The yoyo syndrome

[robindubois]

Now we know for sure what the majority have expected for the last 9 months, last seasons 3 clubs promoted to the PL are coming straight back down and the gulf between the PL and Championship is getting wider and wider. Next year's new TV deal will supposedly try to even things out financially (joke) but in reality I expect little impact so it is time for a bit of lateral thinking.

I would propose that each season the 3 promoted clubs are given a seasons grace during which they cannot be relegated and hence are guaranteed 2 seasons in the PL

The advantages to the clubs are that they have 4 transfer windows, 2 seasons of PL money and 2 seasons of playing time to try to step up and close the gap with the PL. 

The 3 clubs to be relegated from the PL each season will be the 3 lowest points scorers excluding the promoted club. This will add to the attractiveness of the PL with a bigger and maybe better group involved in the fight to stay up. It will also mean that each season the PL will include 6 teams promoted from the Championship in the last 2 seasons- levelling up.

It will freshen up the Championship with some new potentially bigger clubs coming down maybe improving the standard of football and attendances and will also have an impact on how the transfer market works.

The only down side in the Championship is that it may make the chances of clubs such as our selves getting anywhere above a play-off spot even harder and make life for teams coming from up from League One a little harder - although Ipswich disagree.

The big downside in the PL is that it could lead to the top 10 for so forming a break away elite league or join a European supper league. No doubt Sky would have a big say on that and maybe cut their 'sponsorship' of the EFL.

It will not solve all the problems and maybe only be a half way solution but one that can be built on.

I am not in favour of play- offs between the bottom clubs in one league against top teams in the league below - football should be decided over a season not one game which puts a case for not having play-offs at all - but money talks and as it stands stopping play-off would make the yoyo syndrome worse

As for next season Ipswich will need some major work to survive, Leicester are better placed but if they get the sort of FFP penalties that Forest somehow avoided they will be trouble and maybe even without penalties will struggle. The play-off clubs are all likely to be down there as well although Southampton probably are best placed.  

All wishful thinking but something has to give soon 

[Marc]

It's a nice idea, but it'll never happen. The Premier League clubs won't vote for it as it'll increase their chances of relegation. Clubs like Everton, Forest, Brentford etc, would be a firm no.

[hitmanrangers]

May 12, 2024 8:45:54 GMT robindubois said:

Now we know for sure what the majority have expected for the last 9 months, last seasons 3 clubs promoted to the PL are coming straight back down and the gulf between the PL and Championship is getting wider and wider. Next year's new TV deal will supposedly try to even things out financially (joke) but in reality I expect little impact so it is time for a bit of lateral thinking.

I would propose that each season the 3 promoted clubs are given a seasons grace during which they cannot be relegated and hence are guaranteed 2 seasons in the PL

The advantages to the clubs are that they have 4 transfer windows, 2 seasons of PL money and 2 seasons of playing time to try to step up and close the gap with the PL. 

The 3 clubs to be relegated from the PL each season will be the 3 lowest points scorers excluding the promoted club. This will add to the attractiveness of the PL with a bigger and maybe better group involved in the fight to stay up. It will also mean that each season the PL will include 6 teams promoted from the Championship in the last 2 seasons- levelling up.

It will freshen up the Championship with some new potentially bigger clubs coming down maybe improving the standard of football and attendances and will also have an impact on how the transfer market works.

The only down side in the Championship is that it may make the chances of clubs such as our selves getting anywhere above a play-off spot even harder and make life for teams coming from up from League One a little harder - although Ipswich disagree.

The big downside in the PL is that it could lead to the top 10 for so forming a break away elite league or join a European supper league. No doubt Sky would have a big say on that and maybe cut their 'sponsorship' of the EFL.

It will not solve all the problems and maybe only be a half way solution but one that can be built on.

I am not in favour of play- offs between the bottom clubs in one league against top teams in the league below - football should be decided over a season not one game which puts a case for not having play-offs at all - but money talks and as it stands stopping play-off would make the yoyo syndrome worse

As for next season Ipswich will need some major work to survive, Leicester are better placed but if they get the sort of FFP penalties that Forest somehow avoided they will be trouble and maybe even without penalties will struggle. The play-off clubs are all likely to be down there as well although Southampton probably are best placed.  

All wishful thinking but something has to give soon 

Don’t take this the wrong way, but - an awful idea 🤣. You been drinking mate??

The bottom 3 is the bottom 3 relegated end of.

[robindubois]

May 12, 2024 18:53:28 GMT hitmanrangers said:

May 12, 2024 8:45:54 GMT robindubois said:

Now we know for sure what the majority have expected for the last 9 months, last seasons 3 clubs promoted to the PL are coming straight back down and the gulf between the PL and Championship is getting wider and wider. Next year's new TV deal will supposedly try to even things out financially (joke) but in reality I expect little impact so it is time for a bit of lateral thinking.

I would propose that each season the 3 promoted clubs are given a seasons grace during which they cannot be relegated and hence are guaranteed 2 seasons in the PL

The advantages to the clubs are that they have 4 transfer windows, 2 seasons of PL money and 2 seasons of playing time to try to step up and close the gap with the PL. 

The 3 clubs to be relegated from the PL each season will be the 3 lowest points scorers excluding the promoted club. This will add to the attractiveness of the PL with a bigger and maybe better group involved in the fight to stay up. It will also mean that each season the PL will include 6 teams promoted from the Championship in the last 2 seasons- levelling up.

It will freshen up the Championship with some new potentially bigger clubs coming down maybe improving the standard of football and attendances and will also have an impact on how the transfer market works.

The only down side in the Championship is that it may make the chances of clubs such as our selves getting anywhere above a play-off spot even harder and make life for teams coming from up from League One a little harder - although Ipswich disagree.

The big downside in the PL is that it could lead to the top 10 for so forming a break away elite league or join a European supper league. No doubt Sky would have a big say on that and maybe cut their 'sponsorship' of the EFL.

It will not solve all the problems and maybe only be a half way solution but one that can be built on.

I am not in favour of play- offs between the bottom clubs in one league against top teams in the league below - football should be decided over a season not one game which puts a case for not having play-offs at all - but money talks and as it stands stopping play-off would make the yoyo syndrome worse

As for next season Ipswich will need some major work to survive, Leicester are better placed but if they get the sort of FFP penalties that Forest somehow avoided they will be trouble and maybe even without penalties will struggle. The play-off clubs are all likely to be down there as well although Southampton probably are best placed.  

All wishful thinking but something has to give soon 

Don’t take this the wrong way, but - an awful idea 🤣. You been drinking mate??

The bottom 3 is the bottom 3 relegated end of.

But if the bottom 3 are the bottom 3 relegated end of , why are the top 3 not the top 3 promoted end of.

Why do we have the top 2 promoted and then the lottery of the play-offs to decide who gets the third promotion place. How many times do we see the 5th or 6th place team be handed promotion when 2 or 3 teams finished above them in the season quite often by a large number of points. Leeds just finished 17 points ahead of Norwich and 15 ahead of WBA this season but could well not be promoted with one of. those 2 taking the third spot . .- Fair ? I think not,  as much as I dislike Leeds, seems like an awful idea but they do it.

Off to the pub now 

[Marc]

May 13, 2024 6:56:23 GMT robindubois said:

May 12, 2024 18:53:28 GMT hitmanrangers said:

Don’t take this the wrong way, but - an awful idea 🤣. You been drinking mate??

The bottom 3 is the bottom 3 relegated end of.

But if the bottom 3 are the bottom 3 relegated end of , why are the top 3 not the top 3 promoted end of.

Why do we have the top 2 promoted and then the lottery of the play-offs to decide who gets the third promotion place. How many times do we see the 5th or 6th place team be handed promotion when 2 or 3 teams finished above them in the season quite often by a large number of points. Leeds just finished 17 points ahead of Norwich and 15 ahead of WBA this season but could well not be promoted with one of. those 2 taking the third spot . .- Fair ? I think not,  as much as I dislike Leeds, seems like an awful idea but they do it.

Off to the pub now 

It's quite fair. All teams know the rules before the season starts. They know that if they fail to get one of the 2 automatic promotion spots, they have to go through the play-offs. No one is "handed" promotion, they still have to beat the teams that finished above them then win the final.

Personally, I'm a big fan of the play-offs. If it was just the top 3 going up, a large chunk of the team's seasons would be over by Feb/March. That would mean a lot of dead rubbers being played during the end of season run in.

Another example is the Rugby League Superleague. The team that finishes top gets the League Leader's Shield, but the title is decided by play-offs played out by teams finishing in the top 6 with the Grand Final being played at Old Trafford in October. The thing that makes it fairer is that the top 2 get a bye for the 1st round, playing the winners of 3rd v 6th and 4th v 5th in the semi-finals. No legs, just one-off matches with the highest finishing teams getting home advantage. That's what I'd like to see brought into the football play-offs* so that the semi-finals are one leg with, using this year as an example, Leeds v Norwich at Elland Road and Southampton v WBA at St Marys. **


* It won't happen because of the money the 2 legs bring in
** Yes, I'm aware that it's effectively what we're getting this season after the two 0-0 1st legs




Pint of Guinness, please.

[rickyqpr]

I agree with Marc.
I think without the play-offs the season is much duller for the majority of teams, but it provides something to play for and maintains interest and motivation.
I assume the two-legged approach is to generate income for the teams, but I prefer the National league approach, where the team finishing second gets byes as teams down as far as 7th battle it out with the team finishing higher getting the home advantage for the tie.
I would think there is also an argument for the Championship teams to play their semi-final play-offs at Wembley as well as the final.
As for allowing promoted teams to have a minimum of two years - that will never happen - turkeys voting for Christmas.
I would join you in the pub, but such luxuries are denied me nowadays.

[robindubois]

May 13, 2024 8:48:03 GMT rickyqpr said:

I agree with Marc.
I think without the play-offs the season is much duller for the majority of teams, but it provides something to play for and maintains interest and motivation.
I assume the two-legged approach is to generate income for the teams, but I prefer the National league approach, where the team finishing second gets byes as teams down as far as 7th battle it out with the team finishing higher getting the home advantage for the tie.
I would think there is also an argument for the Championship teams to play their semi-final play-offs at Wembley as well as the final.
As for allowing promoted teams to have a minimum of two years - that will never happen - turkeys voting for Christmas.
I would join you in the pub, but such luxuries are denied me nowadays.

As I said in my OP my suggestion was just wishful thinking and of course it will never happen. The only changes that will come along are those that will make the rich boys richer, the poor boys poorer and the fans p****d off.

Not been to a pub or the Uk for almost 10 years now so a glass of wine on the sofa is about my limit. I'll toast you and Marc next time I open a bottle.