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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 22, 2018 15:41:47 GMT
Ok, looking to get back up off the floor after last night, let us review the situation and sort it out!
Well to start with the positives - what have we got right now?
• A decent midfield although is not firing properly – and certainly not for 90 minutes
• Promising wingers
• Hall returning to fitness and we also now have cover at right back
• 2 ‘promising’ goalkeepers who have both performed very well on loan – one yet to be properly tested in the Championship.
What are the problems?
• We took our goalkeeper for granted and he has left a void that we did not think we had. However, Ingram has sadly lost confidence.
• The defence is disorganised and not good enough for the division.
• 3 strikers who cannot score.
• A manager whose tactics are not fit for purpose.
• If we sack the manager who would replace him?
• A loan market closing next week
So what is it going to take to turn the situation round for the QPR faithful?
• Midfield - Shame we lost Manning. He must come back in January. Make Scowen or Luongo captain and get them to impose themselves more. We need Luongo to rediscover his mojo, but Cousins is not the answer. Chair should be ahead of him.
• Wingers - Get Smythe and BOS also involved with game time and play to their strengths by playing the ball in front of them, not at them.
• Keepers - Ingram needs to be rested and Lumley given his chance. There are 2 games for him to have a go before the window closes. Therefore, Lumley must start Saturday against Wigan.
• Defence - We need a proper leader at the back to organise the line. In many ways this is the most important loan signing. Someone experienced who could hopefully play alongside a fit again Hall, Rangel and Bidwell who should be experienced enough to take direction. Furlong and Kakay to come in when Rangel pegs it. Leistner should drop the captaincy and concentrate on his own game. Bassong cannot be the answer. Leistner and Lynch would hopefully not be first choice then, just back-up.
• Striker - If we sign Wells and Hameed, the fans will be positive again. But if it is not possible, we still need to spend the player budget wisely to find that goal-scorer and time is running out. I truly hope we have contingency plans. If we are going to play Smith, do not cut off the supply by taking off the winger.
• Manager - I think that McClaren deserves 2 -3 more game (including the cup) and then I suspect there will be general agreement as to whether or not he is up to the job. Mick McCarthy is the most experienced of those available, but we will not be spoilt for choice and I truly hope that someone is lined up this time before they wield the axe.
So all we have to do is deliver on the above and then Happy Days again.
Now, where is my sedation…..
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Post by rangersman on Aug 22, 2018 15:48:29 GMT
We should have called McCarthy last night after the game and sacked the clown this morning. Any loans can still be got without him in charge, he is a liability and whoever sanctioned him as manager should also be sacked.
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Post by harr on Aug 22, 2018 16:06:07 GMT
So much to change I think it could be weeks before we sort it, that’s even if we can. The next three - four games we play teams that are going to be around us at the end of the season, if we fail to win many of the next 3-4 then the tougher games come. We could be something like 12 games in with 6 - 8 points .. Will take an effort to turn it around. It’s not looking Rosy at the weekend. Anyway It’s my Sons 21st treat Saturday, so if you hear Jake 21 and picture come up that’s my lad ( hopefully be I n programme, Club are always very very helpful with these sorts of things )he don’t know so will probably kill me ...  . Treating him to a bit of W12 . |
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Post by bowranger on Aug 22, 2018 16:24:43 GMT
We should have called McCarthy last night after the game and sacked the clown this morning. Any loans can still be got without him in charge, he is a liability and whoever sanctioned him as manager should also be sacked. Are you annoyed because them not making the decision this morning means less time for you to prepare your "McCarthy out" posts in time for Christmas.?  |
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Post by bowranger on Aug 22, 2018 16:52:39 GMT
As for the OP, as per I agree with most of what you're saying Ricky.
If this is an issue of a lack of experience/depth as McClaren says it is (I disagree, but he's the boss), then let us try our best to bring in a CB and a striker as he wants and some games to adapt. Crap as we've been, I'd be ok with that because whether it was McClaren or Guardiola in charge, we'd still be trying to get those players in for those positions.
If nothing improves and McClaren's only answer is to bleat on about not getting the players in that he wants, then I can't see where he can go from there. The task becomes to shape and adapt with the players we've got and if he's clearly not up for that, then it doesn't feel like he's got a leg to stand on and will need to go. If Smith and Sylla are what we've got, then bloody keep players on the pitch who can supply their limited tool set, not sub them. You know, the basics.
I quite like Mick McCarthy, on a personal level at least. My only two words of warning about someone like him coming in are:
1. Based on the strengths you list (which I agree with), do you think they can adapt into the kind of tight-knit, blood and thunder football McCarthy is known for? As in, if our strengths lie heavily in a technical midfield, could they adapt to a more basic form of football? And is that the best use of them? For all the hand-wringing neutral fans did about Ipswich fans' treatment of McCarthy because he kept them up, they didn't have to watch his team every week while paying some of the most expensive ticket prices in the division. The football was genuinely appalling. I still feel there's a big grey area between McClaren's utterly naive system and going back to the absolute basics.
2. How often have we collectively cried out for stability, saying we'll compromise and just want to see hard working players and consolidate in the Championship before chucking our toys out of the pram? How many called for Ollie's head when we were never fewer than 6 points above relegation because of the style of play and so on? It's all well and good wanting it now, but what will be like in 6 months time if we're hovering in 17th grinding out bore draws?
Disagree about Leistner, though. He's hard working, nasty and strong - exactly what many of us wanted brought in. I think the problem is that he's only half of the solution for our style of play. We've got the brawn, now we need the footwork and pace, which we lost with Onouha. Or to put it another way, Leistner and Hall could be a very nice pairing at this level - one crushes, one recycles the ball. Lynch and Leistner is a disaster as there's no pace and Lynch is pap. Baptiste and Leistner are far, far too similar and one dimensional. Not saying I'm convinced but he's three games into a new season at a new level in a new country. I think he's alright, give him a bit of slack.
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Post by rangersman on Aug 22, 2018 17:06:02 GMT
We should have called McCarthy last night after the game and sacked the clown this morning. Any loans can still be got without him in charge, he is a liability and whoever sanctioned him as manager should also be sacked. Are you annoyed because them not making the decision this morning means less time for you to prepare your "McCarthy out" posts in time for Christmas.? Well that could well happen i suppose ha ha |
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Post by bowranger on Aug 22, 2018 17:15:07 GMT
Are you annoyed because them not making the decision this morning means less time for you to prepare your "McCarthy out" posts in time for Christmas.? Well that could well happen i suppose ha ha Haha I enjoyed that, fair play. |
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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 22, 2018 17:47:02 GMT
As for the OP, as per I agree with most of what you're saying Ricky. If this is an issue of a lack of experience/depth as McClaren says it is (I disagree, but he's the boss), then let us try our best to bring in a CB and a striker as he wants and some games to adapt. Crap as we've been, I'd be ok with that because whether it was McClaren or Guardiola in charge, we'd still be trying to get those players in for those positions. If nothing improves and McClaren's only answer is to bleat on about not getting the players in that he wants, then I can't see where he can go from there. The task becomes to shape and adapt with the players we've got and if he's clearly not up for that, then it doesn't feel like he's got a leg to stand on and will need to go. If Smith and Sylla are what we've got, then bloody keep players on the pitch who can supply their limited tool set, not sub them. You know, the basics. I quite like Mick McCarthy, on a personal level at least. My only two words of warning about someone like him coming in are: 1. Based on the strengths you list (which I agree with), do you think they can adapt into the kind of tight-knit, blood and thunder football McCarthy is known for? As in, if our strengths lie heavily in a technical midfield, could they adapt to a more basic form of football? And is that the best use of them? For all the hand-wringing neutral fans did about Ipswich fans' treatment of McCarthy because he kept them up, they didn't have to watch his team every week while paying some of the most expensive ticket prices in the division. The football was genuinely appalling. I still feel there's a big grey area between McClaren's utterly naive system and going back to the absolute basics. 2. How often have we collectively cried out for stability, saying we'll compromise and just want to see hard working players and consolidate in the Championship before chucking our toys out of the pram? How many called for Ollie's head when we were never fewer than 6 points above relegation because of the style of play and so on? It's all well and good wanting it now, but what will be like in 6 months time if we're hovering in 17th grinding out bore draws? Disagree about Leistner, though. He's hard working, nasty and strong - exactly what many of us wanted brought in. I think the problem is that he's only half of the solution for our style of play. We've got the brawn, now we need the footwork and pace, which we lost with Onouha. Or to put it another way, Leistner and Hall could be a very nice pairing at this level - one crushes, one recycles the ball. Lynch and Leistner is a disaster as there's no pace and Lynch is pap. Baptiste and Leistner are far, far too similar and one dimensional. Not saying I'm convinced but he's three games into a new season at a new level in a new country. I think he's alright, give him a bit of slack. I will have to give him slack because if we do sign a new centre half it may well be that Leistner will be his partner. We all hope that Hall will get back to the form he showed 2 years ago, but that has to be no more than 50/50 at present. He certainly is not being rushed back, perhaps he will be on the bench on Saturday. But Leistner does not appear to be a leader to me, he certainly does not organise the back 4, he is usually playing deeper and playing the opposition on-side. He gets dragged out of position far too easily for my liking but I agree he is one dimensional though. It is good to see his brute force in action. I will settle for the juries out though regarding the rest of his game because as you say, it is only a handful of games. |
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Post by egranger on Aug 22, 2018 18:08:31 GMT
We get behind the team and support on Saturday
Three points gets us off the bottom - I think there are six teams in our division who have not won yet...
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Post by harr on Aug 22, 2018 18:22:09 GMT
We get behind the team and support on Saturday Three points gets us off the bottom - I think there are six teams in our division who have not won yet... That may change tonight Eg as two bottom battles..... |
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Post by harr on Aug 22, 2018 18:24:44 GMT
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Post by harr on Aug 22, 2018 21:23:03 GMT
No only did we sack NW in the Prem.
This still hurts when NW came back for those 3 - 4 games....
“With a bit of persuasion, I would have stayed there. (QPR) But after we won at Reading, [director of football] Les Ferdinand came into the dressing room and told me that they were appointing Jimmy the next day. It was a bolt out of the blue and I was a bit disappointed but I enjoyed that time so much and I took another job at Rotherham.”
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Post by bowranger on Aug 22, 2018 21:38:06 GMT
No only did we sack NW in the Prem. This still hurts when NW came back for those 3 - 4 games.... “With a bit of persuasion, I would have stayed there. (QPR) But after we won at Reading, [director of football] Les Ferdinand came into the dressing room and told me that they were appointing Jimmy the next day. It was a bolt out of the blue and I was a bit disappointed but I enjoyed that time so much and I took another job at Rotherham.” That's an old chestnut though, it doesn't tell the whole story and that's Warnock being Warnock. He took caretaker control and was around the place but didn't want to work under a DoF and when asked about the managers job, he categorically said no, because his wife was very unwell and he wanted to take a break from football. By the time he did his whole "I've got the bug again" routine and changed his mind, we had already signed up JFH. It's disappointing but the club never said no to Warnock. |
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Post by harr on Aug 22, 2018 22:18:09 GMT
Yeah I know it’s old ground.
But can we 100% say we never said to No to him?
Why would he say Les had told him they were appointing JFH the next day, he wouldn’t lie about that surely.
Anyway he won’t be coming back to LR , not unless Cardiff sack him and Les has moved on ?
We have no idea how this might pan out.
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Post by harr on Aug 22, 2018 23:27:56 GMT
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Post by Lonegunmen on Aug 23, 2018 0:33:18 GMT
1] The players could respond by actually giving a shit.
2] Our 3 scoreless strikers could fix it by starting to score - it's not like we are not creating chances.
3] Our defence could help by doing their frigging Job.
4] Les could do something about loan signings and at least try and sell the club to any player remotely interested.
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Post by bowranger on Aug 23, 2018 9:12:17 GMT
Yeah I know it’s old ground. But can we 100% say we never said to No to him? Why would he say Les had told him they were appointing JFH the next day, he wouldn’t lie about that surely. Anyway he won’t be coming back to LR , not unless Cardiff sack him and Les has moved on ? We have no idea how this might pan out. We can't 100% know but Warnock is the wiliest of old foxes (and I love him for that) and he spins that story in a positive light for his own benefit. He's not lying about us saying "no" to him, he just leaves out the context. He effectively announced his retirement in 2016 and his wife was going through Cancer treatment. My understanding was QPR were interested but he categorically said no, he could not commit to a first team manager role. So we looked elsewhere and got a new manager signed up, which was the right thing to do. By the time he changed his mind, it was too late and he took on Rotherham. That bizarre win at Reading does kind of put rose-tinted glasses on things. We were bang average that night and got the result purely from Al-Habsi inexplicably dropping the ball into his own net. It was absolutely hilarious, was a great end to the evening. As an aside, my conspiracy theory based on rumours at the time was that when Warnock first started hanging around the place again, he actually fancied the Director of Football role for himself - something more stable and long-term before retirement that wouldn't require all the travelling and pressure of a manager role while his wife recovered. Just think we've got enough on our plate already without pining over Warnock, you know? |
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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 23, 2018 9:57:38 GMT
The life of a football manager is indeed a crazy one.
I agree with Bow that Warnock is a past master at rewriting history - a one man PR machine going nuts on the touch line so that the cameras can capture his angst.
Enjoyed his time with us, but I watch with interest how he does this year. Interesting though that the money he has spent has been on good Championship players. At least they should be able to bounce back if they are relegated.
Meanwhile, Gary Rowett who we have courted on more than one occasion may be in more trouble than Shteve.
The chants of 'sacked in the morning' and 'you don't know what you are doing' very loud last night.
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Post by bowranger on Aug 23, 2018 10:14:38 GMT
The life of a football manager is indeed a crazy one. I agree with Bow that Warnock is a past master at rewriting history - a one man PR machine going nuts on the touch line so that the cameras can capture his angst. Enjoyed his time with us, but I watch with interest how he does this year. Interesting though that the money he has spent has been on good Championship players. At least they should be able to bounce back if they are relegated. Meanwhile, Gary Rowett who we have courted on more than one occasion may be in more trouble than Shteve. The chants of 'sacked in the morning' and 'you don't know what you are doing' very loud last night. Indeed. And it's a precarious role where perceptions can shift very quickly - arguably quicker than for a footballer. Unless you're on the old boy merry-go-round where Teflon-coated figures like Redknapp and Pardew keep getting work regardless, you're only as good as your last job. Warnock knows this very well and plays the game exceptionally well. He may be all angst and niggling on the surface but there's a very shrewd, experienced PR man operating under that exterior and with good reason. It's partly why I don't fly off the handle at post-match interviews or PR guff the club chucks out. It can be annoying but these are people who know they're expendable and a lightning rod for anger. Gary Rowett is a great example. I'd also chuck in Garry Monk (taking on a MAD job at Brum), Mark Warburton (unemployed), Paul Clement (appalling last season, yet to win this season bar a cup game...against Monk's Birmingham). All hailed as messiahs at various places. The book 'Living on the Volcano' is a decent read in terms of the modern managerial experience, would recommend it. |
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Post by harr on Aug 23, 2018 10:20:02 GMT
The life of a football manager is indeed a crazy one. I agree with Bow that Warnock is a past master at rewriting history - a one man PR machine going nuts on the touch line so that the cameras can capture his angst. Enjoyed his time with us, but I watch with interest how he does this year. Interesting though that the money he has spent has been on good Championship players. At least they should be able to bounce back if they are relegated. Meanwhile, Gary Rowett who we have courted on more than one occasion may be in more trouble than Shteve. The chants of 'sacked in the morning' and 'you don't know what you are doing' very loud last night. Gone off Rowett, just seems to head wherever the next bag of cash is. No thanks from me anymore. |
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Post by harr on Aug 23, 2018 10:23:34 GMT
Yeah I know it’s old ground. But can we 100% say we never said to No to him? Why would he say Les had told him they were appointing JFH the next day, he wouldn’t lie about that surely. Anyway he won’t be coming back to LR , not unless Cardiff sack him and Les has moved on ? We have no idea how this might pan out. We can't 100% know but Warnock is the wiliest of old foxes (and I love him for that) and he spins that story in a positive light for his own benefit. He's not lying about us saying "no" to him, he just leaves out the context. He effectively announced his retirement in 2016 and his wife was going through Cancer treatment. My understanding was QPR were interested but he categorically said no, he could not commit to a first team manager role. So we looked elsewhere and got a new manager signed up, which was the right thing to do. By the time he changed his mind, it was too late and he took on Rotherham. That bizarre win at Reading does kind of put rose-tinted glasses on things. We were bang average that night and got the result purely from Al-Habsi inexplicably dropping the ball into his own net. It was absolutely hilarious, was a great end to the evening. As an aside, my conspiracy theory based on rumours at the time was that when Warnock first started hanging around the place again, he actually fancied the Director of Football role for himself - something more stable and long-term before retirement that wouldn't require all the travelling and pressure of a manager role while his wife recovered. Just think we've got enough on our plate already without pining over Warnock, you know? Yep, your probably right. Cant blame him while he put everything on the back burner for his wife though. Lots of people forget what he achieved at Rotherham, that was some escape. I always have an interest in the Cardiff results. Im certainly not pining over him However we might be in Rotherham’s position come Jan and may need him to do the same thing ... |
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Post by Ashdown_Ranger on Aug 23, 2018 11:04:17 GMT
Some thoughts on Ricky's original question...
Midfield - seem hugely affected by Luongo's lack of form since returning from the World Cup. Needs to get his head right.
Manning - loaned to Rotherham - HUGE mistake. Must get him back in January.
Keepers - Ingram's not at the races at the moment. Time for Lumley to be given his chance.
Leistner - after all the good reviews he got, why is he playing so poorly? Baptiste has done OK for us and needs to start next game.
Captain - must have rubbed a few up the wrong way to give new boy Leistner the captaincy. First choice (if he's playing well) would be Luongo, then Hall (if fit) or Scowen.
Loans - Wells and Hameed reported to be agreed pending medicals. Got to be a good thing. Still think we need a proper defender though.
Manager - is he really 'not fit for purpose'? I'd give him time. I doubt we can afford to sack him and we're only 4 games in. I'd give him until at least the November international break.
Hall - I'm worried about his continued absence and somehow doubt he's going to contribute much this season for us.
Furlong - can't come back quickly enough!
Mick McCarthy - lots of social media comments calling for him to be brought in. He left Ipswich after dogs' abuse from fans - he'd be off after a couple of weeks at QPR then...
I made a comment last week that Warnock might get his traditional Premier League sacking in the Autumn. Amit worked well with him last time round when Flabio was ditched after failing 'fit and proper person' rules. So if McClaren hasn't turned things around by then..?
My comment was meant tongue-in-cheek, but who knows...
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