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Post by rickyqpr on Nov 28, 2020 9:54:23 GMT
I thought that last night showed we are not too far off of Brentford as a team & if their player had been sent off we MAY have won. What was good was to see a Championship match on Sky that was full of football being played & entertaining. I'm not sure how I would mark the referee. The non sending off was a huge mistake, but otherwise I thought he was good. I agree Terry, with Brentford devoid of two great players from last season and our own similar recruitment strategy, there is currently not a lot in it. The ref as you say got the big one wrong, Kane had to go (pretty naive stuff again) but I thought that he could have done better with the treatment Dykes received in the second half. A yellow could have changed the game. I am not arguing for VAR in the Championship - far from it, but what concerns me is that the refs are wired up to the rest of their team and surely the lino should have been up with play and could see he was the last man etc? The same lino flagged Toney offside when trying to look through a closer Brentford player who was clearly offside but not interfering. How could he see that fine margin that the cameras could not even define. The ref was well behind play for the Dykes decision, but as a team of officials, I think they got the big ones wrong IMHO.
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Post by rickyqpr on Nov 28, 2020 10:06:18 GMT
Live on Sky - usual result after a decent performance Three thoughts 1. When will we get a decent ref. Watford game our man thrown to the ground - definite penalty not given - likely cost us 2 points. Brentford - Dykes hauled down by their last man looked in the box to me (biased) - definite red card and a penalty not given likely cost us 3 points or at least 1. No doubt we have got away with some as well but have also suffered some soft decisions against us. Kane - 2 yellows last night - by the rules ok but if they were 2 yellows mean red the Dykes foul was 100% red. 2 games, potential 5 points lost makes the difference between mid table and a play off position. 2. I want to see Kelman get on the pitch soon - must be able to give him at least 30 minutes sometime in December. No harm in in trying - seems a natural goal scorer so 15 minutes at the end last night would have been great and if he scored on Sky, up goes his value. Yes they have to learn their trade but no harm with the odd rare talent learning on the pitch with us, Sibley, Francis Busby etc etc........ The alternative is likely leave him on the bench this season - loan him out next season, get one good season for us then the big boys snap him up. Good for a bit of finance but we miss 2 seasons of a goal scorer doing his job for us. 3. Left back - Wallace I think is just past it physically after his injuries - his brain probably knows what to do but his body does not keep up.. Nico - half a dozen games in and some are writing him off already, after a couple of years of the same fans screaming for him to play. Give the guy a chance - it's a big step up. If no signs of him making it by January hit the loan or transfer market but get off his back now he needs encouragement not criticism. Manning is gone, Manning did not want to play for us anymore without more money. Forget him and move on. 1. The standard of Championship officials continues to be poor, where as in the Prem, I think that behave differently now, knowing all their decisions will be tested by technology and so they just defer. 2. I understand your point. Throwing Bonne on for Hamalainen was just that, the last throw, it could just as easily have been Kelman - especially with hindsight. Then having lost Kane, we were playing two at the back anyway. 3. Left back is still a challenge and at best it is a work in progress. I guess much will depend on who we sign in January. As Hector does not get a kick at Fulham and we failed with a late loan deal last time, that he may be on his way. That may facilitate a move for Barbet to left back - I think he is less risky there although he has had a couple of decent games recently. As I said above, I think that Hamalainen is much better when operating in a decent left pairing, but the opposition in the last few games have targeted our young full backs at times.= and I think Nico was lucky to get away with a 50/50 penalty shout on Tuesday.
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Post by bowranger on Nov 28, 2020 10:07:10 GMT
I thought that last night showed we are not too far off of Brentford as a team & if their player had been sent off we MAY have won. What was good was to see a Championship match on Sky that was full of football being played & entertaining. I'm not sure how I would mark the referee. The non sending off was a huge mistake, but otherwise I thought he was good. My customary referree mini moan. Red card, like you say, huge mistake. At the time all I considered was "what if this was 11 v 10?" But in retrospect, I think of the chance too. Without that shove, that's Dykes, form of his life for Scotland, in one on one. We'd back him there. Instead it's a free kick on the edge of the box and well...our record of free kicks speaks for itself. It fundamentally changes the game. Example exists in the game itself - Kane gets sent off (don't disagree, Kane's second yellow is clumsy and you just don't risk those kinds challenges on a yellow) just as we are getting back into it, and it utterly deflates us. It's the inconsistencies that get me. First half, Dalsgaard gets a throw-in called against him, he screams in the linesman's face, tells him to "F*** off" so loudly that the commentators apologise for it (do always enjoy that). Nothing. Ball has a moan and chucks the ball into the ground, immediate yellow. I do whine about refs but it's not from a place of thinking they're cheats or anything. I hate VAR, I think with games going at 100 mph marginal mistakes can and will happen and I'll take that all day over micro-managing decisions like Thomas Frank has a hard-on for (for example, Toney's disallowed goal was very tight and I'd feel hard done by if that was us). But stuff where you've got near identical situations, same game but different outcomes, irk me. I don't get it. Sigh. Agree about the pace of the game, particularly in the first half. Two teams playing a technical, attractive brand of football, flying at eachother. Was exciting stuff. Brentford look bigger and more physical than last year. Not as attractive but a bit more streetwise and cynical, less of a soft underbelly, starting to grind stuff out. It's a weird thing to say, but they look worse than last year but in a very Championship way, actually more competitive?
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Post by bowranger on Nov 28, 2020 10:12:07 GMT
Live on Sky - usual result after a decent performance Three thoughts 1. When will we get a decent ref. Watford game our man thrown to the ground - definite penalty not given - likely cost us 2 points. Brentford - Dykes hauled down by their last man looked in the box to me (biased) - definite red card and a penalty not given likely cost us 3 points or at least 1. No doubt we have got away with some as well but have also suffered some soft decisions against us. Kane - 2 yellows last night - by the rules ok but if they were 2 yellows mean red the Dykes foul was 100% red. 2 games, potential 5 points lost makes the difference between mid table and a play off position. 2. I want to see Kelman get on the pitch soon - must be able to give him at least 30 minutes sometime in December. No harm in in trying - seems a natural goal scorer so 15 minutes at the end last night would have been great and if he scored on Sky, up goes his value. Yes they have to learn their trade but no harm with the odd rare talent learning on the pitch with us, Sibley, Francis Busby etc etc........ The alternative is likely leave him on the bench this season - loan him out next season, get one good season for us then the big boys snap him up. Good for a bit of finance but we miss 2 seasons of a goal scorer doing his job for us. 3. Left back - Wallace I think is just past it physically after his injuries - his brain probably knows what to do but his body does not keep up.. Nico - half a dozen games in and some are writing him off already, after a couple of years of the same fans screaming for him to play. Give the guy a chance - it's a big step up. If no signs of him making it by January hit the loan or transfer market but get off his back now he needs encouragement not criticism. Manning is gone, Manning did not want to play for us anymore without more money. Forget him and move on. 1. The standard of Championship officials continues to be poor, where as in the Prem, I think that behave differently now, knowing all their decisions will be tested by technology and so they just defer. 2. I understand your point. Throwing Bonne on for Hamalainen was just that, the last throw, it could just as easily have been Kelman - especially with hindsight. Then having lost Kane, we were playing two at the back anyway. 3. Left back is still a challenge and at best it is a work in progress. I guess much will depend on who we sign in January. As Hector does not get a kick at Fulham and we failed with a late loan deal last time, that he may be on his way. That may facilitate a move for Barbet to left back - I think he is less risky there although he has had a couple of decent games recently. As I said above, I think that Hamalainen is much better when operating in a decent left pairing, but the opposition in the last few games have targeted our young full backs at times.= and I think Nico was lucky to get away with a 50/50 penalty shout on Tuesday. Particularly agree about Niko and his pairings. He looked a lot more vulnerable when Willock went off. Like you say, work in progress. Cribbing from opinions over on LFW but for Toney's headed goal, Niko rightly got some stick for letting the striker get ahead of him, but also, why is he Niko's man? Does seem weird to me - surely you'd stick Dickie on him?
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Post by Marc on Nov 28, 2020 10:21:34 GMT
Never got to watch the game last night as I was watching the Superleague Grand Final but was following updates on Twitter and it seemed like we were holding our own until the latter stages. Looks like the Brentford & Friday night hoodoos are still with us.
As for the Rugby, absolutely incredible evening. If you have a spare 8 minutes or so, I recommend giving this a watch. This is the reason I have become a little lukewarm towards football in recent years (QPR is the only exception). If you are looking for true passion in sport, this should be your first stop.
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Post by stylecouncillor on Nov 28, 2020 11:54:44 GMT
My view of last night is , I thought we did very well. In the the last few games we've played Bournemouth Watford and now Brentford. We have more than held our own against 3 sides who are going to be there abouts come the end of the season. Warburton fooled us never mind Brentford with the messages coming out of the club during the week. Safe to say them like us thought we were heading into the game with a very weakened defence. They set out their team on the assumption of an easy evening over running us , never happened and for a little more luck we could of been in front by the break against 10 men before they got reorganised. The second half sending off was just one more thing you can not do anymore. that be challenge on a yellow card. Both players went for the ball feet up studs showing. The Brentford man touches the ball just before Kane, Kane gets the yellow. To be honest when Niko got his yellow in the first half I thought he would get the 2nd and go off. I think that has more to do with his performance as anything, so as a defender what is it you do ? Play like Kane or Niko ? Brentfords offside goal. As much as sky bang on about how var would of given a goal there was as much chance of them giving offside be that the player offside on the pitch not with the ball or Toneys arm toe or shoulder. Now that is stupid but it is what happens. That all said Toney did get man of the match as much for his defensive work as his attacking which says alot about our efforts as his. The final reason I think I am pleased with our performance is because even when down to 10 men it was us Pushing for a goal right up to the last kick, rather than our falling to pieces and getting hammered like in recent years. Its just nice to see a more fighting spirit and effort.
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LifeR
Ian Holloway
Posts: 480
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Post by LifeR on Nov 28, 2020 13:26:13 GMT
Live on Sky - usual result after a decent performance Three thoughts 1. When will we get a decent ref. Watford game our man thrown to the ground - definite penalty not given - likely cost us 2 points. Brentford - Dykes hauled down by their last man looked in the box to me (biased) - definite red card and a penalty not given likely cost us 3 points or at least 1. No doubt we have got away with some as well but have also suffered some soft decisions against us. Kane - 2 yellows last night - by the rules ok but if they were 2 yellows mean red the Dykes foul was 100% red. 2 games, potential 5 points lost makes the difference between mid table and a play off position. 2. I want to see Kelman get on the pitch soon - must be able to give him at least 30 minutes sometime in December. No harm in in trying - seems a natural goal scorer so 15 minutes at the end last night would have been great and if he scored on Sky, up goes his value. Yes they have to learn their trade but no harm with the odd rare talent learning on the pitch with us, Sibley, Francis Busby etc etc........ The alternative is likely leave him on the bench this season - loan him out next season, get one good season for us then the big boys snap him up. Good for a bit of finance but we miss 2 seasons of a goal scorer doing his job for us. 3. Left back - Wallace I think is just past it physically after his injuries - his brain probably knows what to do but his body does not keep up.. Nico - half a dozen games in and some are writing him off already, after a couple of years of the same fans screaming for him to play. Give the guy a chance - it's a big step up. If no signs of him making it by January hit the loan or transfer market but get off his back now he needs encouragement not criticism. Manning is gone, Manning did not want to play for us anymore without more money. Forget him and move on. Have to agree, we will see him. Hoops tinted glasses, but wouldn't it be something if he was Paul Goddard rather than Connor Washington. If he is halfway decent there will be collective wild euphoria from Rs supporters!
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Post by nomar on Nov 29, 2020 11:25:33 GMT
Only saw the last few minutes, but there’s no shame in losing 2-1 to Brentford.
This is where we are right now and in a much better position than I thought we’d be a month ago.
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Post by bowranger on Nov 29, 2020 11:36:35 GMT
Only saw the last few minutes, but there’s no shame in losing 2-1 to Brentford. This is where we are right now and in a much better position than I thought we’d be a month ago. Yeah, pretty much agree. I know you don't win prizes for effort or style, points are points, but it does make a difference in terms of the experience as a fan. Last time out at Brentford away, we were cack. Just not at it. On Friday, we were well in it and few moments go our way, it is a different result. Always disappointed when we lose but can hold our heads up for much of that performance. It's still a marker of progress.
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Post by bowranger on Dec 1, 2020 9:22:03 GMT
Or Furlong!
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Post by rickyqpr on Dec 1, 2020 9:24:11 GMT
Don Givens needed 3 chances to put one away and yet was prolific. Playing with Stan helped a tad though.
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LifeR
Ian Holloway
Posts: 480
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Post by LifeR on Dec 1, 2020 12:46:39 GMT
Regarding Kelman, his lack of experience/age and the jump from the Shrimpers works against him, but Warbs may have no choice with knocks and fatigue from the schedule.
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