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Post by Macmoish on Jan 21, 2018 7:18:00 GMT
Tony Fernandes Had injuries galore , big squad etc etc. All been talked about. Patience is the name of the game. Think the spirit in the squad is great down to the manager. The players are good. Just need to take chances . Need to stegthen in one or two areas. Lots of grea work has been done which no one sees. I’m limiting myself on qpr tweets. Very frustrating seeing short term ness of certain fans. Disappointing yesterday. But we made one mistake and just didn’t take our chances. Manager is trimming his squad which is good. And we have 5 academy players being blooded in .
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Post by marshbowles10 on Jan 21, 2018 8:12:21 GMT
What game does he watch?
Short term-ism of fans?
TF I've been watching for 55 years and my short term view is that the management is not clever enough, not tactically gifted enough and that the combination of IH and MB is effectively not strong enough,
They are too similar and whilst both wear their hearts on their sleeve, this is not much use if after 35 minutes you have a centre back playing centre forward?
TF "The players are good we just need to take our chances".
Half of this statement is correct,
"we do need to take our chances" but I'm really sorry, in Washington and Smith your definitions of 'good' and mine do not agree. The player that looked most likely to score yesterday was Jack Robinson.
Wake up and realise that unless we have someone that can score goals we are not going to win a game. It's pretty basic stuff really.
Great to see young players coming through but they need to be introduced in a clever and controlled manner. The kids yesterday looked out of their depth. Boys against men.
"Patience id the name of the game". TF, us short term fans are very patient, we have to be.
We are patient despite the stupidity of you and your useless board under Phil (whatever money or contract they want) Beard. You risked the future of the Club not playing 'patience' which is a controlled and clever game but playing football roulette which was stupid.
We're still here, us short term fans. Paying £35 to watch us lose at fortress Loftus Road 0-3. Will we be here at the next game us short term-ism fans? Yes.
I'm not sure if you were there yesterday but were I in your shoes (I'd love your money) I wouldn't tweet, but if I did it would have been
"Disappointing yesterday against a strong and disciplined Middlesborough but at least giving some of the youngsters a chance.. We are looking to strengthen the forward line as it is obvious that this is an area that needs addressing. It's not that easy to find players with the right attitude and within budget, please rest assured we are trying. Thank you for your support"
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Post by harr on Jan 21, 2018 8:34:15 GMT
Whatever Tony, heard it a million times
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Post by nomar on Jan 21, 2018 10:41:59 GMT
What game does he watch? Short term-ism of fans? TF I've been watching for 55 years and my short term view is that the management is not clever enough, not tactically gifted enough and that the combination of IH and MB is effectively not strong enough, They are too similar and whilst both wear their hearts on their sleeve, this is not much use if after 35 minutes you have a centre back playing centre forward? TF "The players are good we just need to take our chances". Half of this statement is correct, "we do need to take our chances" but I'm really sorry, in Washington and Smith your definitions of 'good' and mine do not agree. The player that looked most likely to score yesterday was Jack Robinson. Wake up and realise that unless we have someone that can score goals we are not going to win a game. It's pretty basic stuff really. Great to see young players coming through but they need to be introduced in a clever and controlled manner. The kids yesterday looked out of their depth. Boys against men. "Patience id the name of the game". TF, us short term fans are very patient, we have to be. We are patient despite the stupidity of you and your useless board under Phil (whatever money or contract they want) Beard. You risked the future of the Club not playing 'patience' which is a controlled and clever game but playing football roulette which was stupid. We're still here, us short term fans. Paying £35 to watch us lose at fortress Loftus Road 0-3. Will we be here at the next game us short term-ism fans? Yes. I'm not sure if you were there yesterday but were I in your shoes (I'd love your money) I wouldn't tweet, but if I did it would have been "Disappointing yesterday against a strong and disciplined Middlesborough but at least giving some of the youngsters a chance.. We are looking to strengthen the forward line as it is obvious that this is an area that needs addressing. It's not that easy to find players with the right attitude and within budget, please rest assured we are trying. Thank you for your support" All of this is fine and I’m certainly not on of Tony Fernandes’ fans at all. But, where do you propose we get this amazing striker that everybody wants from, based on the fact that we actually still need to sell players to keep within FFP limits and avoid, say, a transfer embargo (which would really kill the QPR fans out there who scream for multiple new signings every time we lose a game)? IH isn’t a great manager, we all know that. But at this stage of the season who would you get to replace him? Then tell them they have eff all money to go out and buy anyone. TF and his cronies most certainly have put us in this mess with their gross irresponsibility but this isn’t a problem that’s going to get fixed in one season or by just buying the next Charlie Austin..
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Post by marshbowles10 on Jan 21, 2018 12:14:33 GMT
Nomar, I'm not employed by the club in a scouting capacity. I'm not paid to scour the country 24/7 trying to unearth the next person that has the ability to put the ball in the back of the net. What I do see is a team that seems not to have a clue how to play to their strengths and players not actually improving their ability. Washington has been and remains dire as a striker. I feel sorry for him I truly do but he seems like a lost soul that doesn't know how to score.
We have experts paid to scout the country, Ian got in Gary Penrice to do that, perhaps it would be nice to get a Penrice report from time to time? Off subject but perhaps there are too many ex mates in the club and therefore the perspective just isn't there and neither are new ideas.
I have not said get rid of IH at all.
I think Ian does need someone with a different perspective and someone more tactically skilled than Marc B.
I love Marc and his blue and white hair but he appears out of his depth. Where is the intelligence?
Why do we have wingers that are neither played nor operate as wingers. Why does the centre half play at centre forward after 30 minutes? Can someone explain to me what formation we play and what was the game strategy yesterday?
My piece was in response to TF's tweet that said we were effectively unlucky yesterday and everything in the garden was rosy. I just think that we should be treated with a modicum of respect and honesty.
All of us on the MB want us to succeed. I am very worried about going into administration if we get hit with a massive fine and am pleased that we are now cutting our cloth accordingly. But we still paid Blackpool £1 million for Samuel, OK int today's environment that's about a month of Alexis's salary at Man U (or is it 2 weeks?).
I remain very concerned that we will be in the relegation shake up and whilst there are probably 3 teams that are worse than us, that doesn't always mean that we'll finish above them. This is QPR!
But we've all got opinions and that's what this message board is all about!
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Post by harr on Jan 21, 2018 12:36:26 GMT
I will remain very concerned until we get 5 more wins. Our defence has been frail in all the time IH has been in charge, never been addressed.
As we know already, Ollie has already had three runs where he barely picked up a point in 7-8 matches. If we end the season with one of those runs again, expect us to be involved in the mix.
Feb appears to be our best month for picking up wins, if they don’t come we may be in trouble.
Most Rangers fans still think we will get to 50 points easily but then again this is QPR we are talking about.
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Post by bowranger on Jan 21, 2018 13:12:12 GMT
Don't actually disagree with anything he says there. It's just a little rich from him preaching patience and growth to frustrated people when it was him who arguably was instrumental in creating the short termism of the previous years in the first place.
A lot of the abuse and bile the club, players and staff get online is utterly unjustifiable, for the record. I'd be annoyed if I was him too and not sure what else he's supposed to say. But still feels a little irksome him crowing about a change of tact, no matter if he's belatedly in the right.
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Post by tightattheback on Jan 21, 2018 15:45:42 GMT
90% agree with everything that you say Marshbowles10. The 10% that I can’t agree with is the 55 years, this short termer has only been going for 51 years. A little naive for such an astute businessman me thinks, may be wiser to steer well clear of twatter as there’s a very good chance of pissing people off.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2018 6:52:12 GMT
This made me chuckle... Thanks...
Ian Holloway should have been sacked back in Sept 17.
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Post by harr on Jan 22, 2018 7:24:40 GMT
Why would IH have been sacked Sept 17 though? To my reckoning the way we started after the first six games, we were in the top six. The only people to sack Managers in the top six are Derby.
I fully agree team Ollie and Bircham have seemed out of there depth at times but sacking in September in our situation would have been one of the weirdest in history.
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Post by superckat on Jan 22, 2018 9:17:55 GMT
Totally agree with a lot said on here. I think Marshbowles should write all of Uncle Tone’s tweets. Summed up perfectly what he should have said.
I do believe we should just let Bircham put the cones out and get someone else who can offer some intelligence and sound advice, to the manager. I don’t see us getting relegated. But I don’t believe that next season will be any different to this, if Ollie doesn’t get more help.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2018 9:17:59 GMT
Well at least we would not be in this situation weird or not. Ian Holloway should have never been appointed a manager in the first place, he is a pundit in my opinion and never a football club manager. Did we not learn the first time around. He has a very poor record indeed. We have also lost really good players, because Ollie does not get on with them, or they are not in his plans. I, like many would love to know his plans, all we ever hear is excuses... We have some really good players with the ability to play in this league, but are not led the right way.... IN MY OPINION..
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Post by harr on Jan 22, 2018 19:14:32 GMT
Any tweets about our upcoming promotion.......
At Game 28
15/16 Ramsey/JFH 35 points, finished with 60. 16/17 JFH / Holloway 33 points finished with 53. 17/18 Holloway on his own 33 points .
Who would have thought when Ramsey was our Manager we would still go backwards in the League for two years....l
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Post by sharky on Jan 22, 2018 22:16:49 GMT
Any tweets about our upcoming promotion....... At Game 28 15/16 Ramsey/JFH 35 points, finished with 60. 16/17 JFH / Holloway 33 points finished with 53. 17/18 Holloway on his own 33 points . Who would have thought when Ramsey was our Manager we would still go backwards in the League for two years....l One word FFP
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Post by harr on Jan 22, 2018 22:24:16 GMT
Any tweets about our upcoming promotion....... At Game 28 15/16 Ramsey/JFH 35 points, finished with 60. 16/17 JFH / Holloway 33 points finished with 53. 17/18 Holloway on his own 33 points . Who would have thought when Ramsey was our Manager we would still go backwards in the League for two years....l One word FFP Yep, totally screwed Sharky. Still on the positive side, we still have the Club we love. I will be happy all summer providing we stay a Championship team
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Post by scarletpimple on Jan 23, 2018 0:48:40 GMT
Just a few years ago we had such high hope's for a coming season.....then fernandes arrived and the downfall began. Now jump forward to the present time, and the wasted money, shoit players we paid big money for and got fock all back in transfer fees, warren farm, 40k stadium,Phillip beal, now we can't afford a pot to piss in and on top of all that we have a manager who has been sacked by four clubs including this one.
We even got a second bite at the prem and still fernandes foocked it up.
The worry is it can still get a lot worse.
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Post by bowranger on Jan 23, 2018 9:40:45 GMT
Well at least we would not be in this situation weird or not.Ian Holloway should have never been appointed a manager in the first place, he is a pundit in my opinion and never a football club manager. Did we not learn the first time around. He has a very poor record indeed. We have also lost really good players, because Ollie does not get on with them, or they are not in his plans. I, like many would love to know his plans, all we ever hear is excuses... We have some really good players with the ability to play in this league, but are not led the right way.... IN MY OPINION.. I am curious, in your opinion of course, what situation are we in ?- lower mid table and trying to survive on a shoe string is no more than we can expect at the moment.
Who would have replaced Ollie? where would we be now and how can that have been guaranteed?.
Which "really good players" have we lost in the last 12 months. If they are any did they go because of Ollie or did we move them out for being high earners?
I think we do hear his and the clubs plans - some just ignore or do not want to accept them. Just curious because I must be missing something here.
Like 99% of the time when you question this kinda stuff (i.e. please back up an argument) it just gets totally ignored. Or it's put down to "oh, I just have a different opinion SORRY etc etc.". But I'd genuinely be interested in the answer to all of those questions from people calling for a managerial shift.
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Post by harr on Jan 23, 2018 10:09:28 GMT
I guess we won’t know how good some of these players are until a different Manager managed them. My guess is we have a top 10 midfield, top 3 goalkeeper, bottom half table defence and bottom six strike force.
We know the issues we are weak in but they are the two areas we always spend the least in for season after season and even prior to FFP.
STRIKER,DEFENCE,STRIKER,DEFENCE,STRIKER,DEFENCE,STRIKER,DEFENCE....I often go to sleep saying the two words....
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Post by rickyqpr on Jan 23, 2018 10:43:04 GMT
Fernandes is not the first football chairman to think that you can run a football club along the same lines as their commercial enterprises. QPR has a history of Chairman who have struggled with the role - the Jim Gregory model was the last enjoyable experience. But Fernandes is all about appointing the right personnel and letting then get on with it and then wallowing in the positive PR that follows. He wants to be Mr. Popular and has tried to do every job at every level for Air Asia - even working as a baggage handler. He openly admits that he trusted the wrong people to 'manage' QPR. Beard's experience at the O2 never carried over to any form of property / stadium management. Successive managers and agents seduced him into being stupid with his money. He was irresponsible in his quest for glory. Unfortunately for QPR, FFP means that the experience cannot just be written off, instead we will be living with the consequences for some time to come. But he believes that in Hoos and Ferdinand, he now has the correct people to trust and get on with it - and so do I for the record! I think our club started to recover with these appointments, but it is not a quick fix. As others have said regarding the manager, Holloway has obvious weaknesses but he also has strengths that are often overlooked. We had a poor end to last season as Holloway became the tinker man. On Saturday, sending Lynch up as centre forward was classic Holloway tinkering. Not for the first time we ended up with countless forwards on the pitch as he throws the kitchen sink at the opposition - and then got caught on the break for the 3rd goal. Any incoming manager will be forced to work with the existing squad. He would have to evaluate the squad and that will take time - and as said above - we do not know for sure that more can be achieved from the current squad. So my view is that QPR should stick with the current set up until the end of the season and then review progress or lack of it.
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Post by Macmoish on Jan 23, 2018 10:57:27 GMT
What really mystifies me is how many Chairman screw up - Don't learn lessons of other Chairman/other clubs.
Obviously you can't guarantee success or making profits. But you can certainly remove some of the mistakes; minimize your financial losses etc
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Post by harr on Jan 23, 2018 11:05:57 GMT
18 games to go, exactly same points total as last year. Less points than Ramsey/JFH season by gaining stability and keeping one Manager for the whole season....
You could argue there’s very little progress at all, some would consider we are already going backwards.
The only luxury IH has is everything gets blamed on FFP.
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Post by bowranger on Jan 23, 2018 13:23:54 GMT
18 games to go, exactly same points total as last year. Less points than Ramsey/JFH season by gaining stability and keeping one Manager for the whole season.... You could argue there’s very little progress at all, some would consider we are already going backwards. The only luxury IH has is everything gets blamed on FFP. I'm not really sure on what metric we could argue we've gone backwards - we're essentially treading water while the off the pitch situation has got worse. Meanwhile, lots of the stuff almost everyone seemed to agree we wanted to happen is starting to happen. Youth integration. Weeding out of the high earners. A group of players that play with pride. It's only a brief tour around recent history to see the situation faced by clubs bigger than us in similar circumstances. Bristol City, Leeds, Norwich, Sheffield Utd, Wolves etc. All were in the absolute financial bin, all of them dropped to League One. The fact we're out of the relegation spots operating at a loss on smaller attendances means things could be a lot, lot worse. I also do not think that's much of a luxury for Holloway. Have you looked around the internet? There are swathes of people online who lay blame at Ollie's door. Or on Ferdinand's shoulders. Meanwhile complaining that we're not spending money. He's not blameless but the idea that after JFH, Ramsey and Holloway that this is simply a managerial issue doesn't seem to stack up. Meanwhile those who think it is never come back with any realistic alternative. It feels like an excuse just to have a knock at his expense. FFP isn't some vague excuse, it dominates everything about what our club is about right now. It's simply venting and it's incredibly boring and toxic.
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Post by harr on Jan 23, 2018 13:42:02 GMT
18 games to go, exactly same points total as last year. Less points than Ramsey/JFH season by gaining stability and keeping one Manager for the whole season.... You could argue there’s very little progress at all, some would consider we are already going backwards. The only luxury IH has is everything gets blamed on FFP. I'm not really sure on what metric we could argue we've gone backwards - we're essentially treading water while the off the pitch situation has got worse. Meanwhile, lots of the stuff almost everyone seemed to agree we wanted to happen is starting to happen. Youth integration. Weeding out of the high earners. A group of players that play with pride. It's only a brief tour around recent history to see the situation faced by clubs bigger than us in similar circumstances. Bristol City, Leeds, Norwich, Sheffield Utd, Wolves etc. All were in the absolute financial bin, all of them dropped to League One. The fact we're out of the relegation spots operating at a loss on smaller attendances means things could be a lot, lot worse. I also do not think that's much of a luxury for Holloway. Have you looked around the internet? There are swathes of people online who lay blame at Ollie's door. Or on Ferdinand's shoulders. Meanwhile complaining that we're not spending money. He's not blameless but the idea that after JFH, Ramsey and Holloway that this is simply a managerial issue doesn't seem to stack up. Meanwhile those who think it is never come back with any realistic alternative. It feels like an excuse just to have a knock at his expense. FFP isn't some vague excuse, it dominates everything about what our club is about right now. It's simply venting and it's incredibly boring and toxic. My point about going backwards only relates to the points the football team accumulate throughout the season Bow. I’m not suggesting here in any way or form that other things around the Club are not changing or going in a better direction or questioning that the current players don’t play with pride etc. My only point is again we are hovering just above the relegation zone for the second year. Should be be just happy we are not actually in the relegation zone or should we expect more in terms of points, wins, draws, away wins, clean sheets, even with FFP noose around us.
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Post by bowranger on Jan 23, 2018 13:55:44 GMT
I'm not really sure on what metric we could argue we've gone backwards - we're essentially treading water while the off the pitch situation has got worse. Meanwhile, lots of the stuff almost everyone seemed to agree we wanted to happen is starting to happen. Youth integration. Weeding out of the high earners. A group of players that play with pride. It's only a brief tour around recent history to see the situation faced by clubs bigger than us in similar circumstances. Bristol City, Leeds, Norwich, Sheffield Utd, Wolves etc. All were in the absolute financial bin, all of them dropped to League One. The fact we're out of the relegation spots operating at a loss on smaller attendances means things could be a lot, lot worse. I also do not think that's much of a luxury for Holloway. Have you looked around the internet? There are swathes of people online who lay blame at Ollie's door. Or on Ferdinand's shoulders. Meanwhile complaining that we're not spending money. He's not blameless but the idea that after JFH, Ramsey and Holloway that this is simply a managerial issue doesn't seem to stack up. Meanwhile those who think it is never come back with any realistic alternative. It feels like an excuse just to have a knock at his expense. FFP isn't some vague excuse, it dominates everything about what our club is about right now. It's simply venting and it's incredibly boring and toxic. My point about going backwards only relates to the points the football team accumulate throughout the season Bow. I’m not suggesting here in any way or form that other things around the Club are not changing or going in a better direction or questioning that the current players don’t play with pride etc. My only point is again we are hovering just above the relegation zone for the second year. Should be be just happy we are not actually in the relegation zone or should we expect more in terms of points, wins, draws, away wins, clean sheets, even with FFP noose around us. I'm not saying we should be happy about it, I just find it tiring how it's just constant reiteration of it not being that good and the constant vague digs without any consideration of what else the club should be doing.
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Post by rickyqpr on Jan 23, 2018 14:04:06 GMT
The FFP issue is huge and unprecedented in football. The fine we are facing is incredible (and unfair) but the shareholders have said that they will cover it. Had they decided to walk away there would be no QPR and we would have to start again as AFC QPR like Wimbledon and countless other clubs. Of course they could still renege on their promise to dip into their pockets. The on-line community seem to have moved on with 'They caused the mess so they can pay the fine' - but it is business and they do not have to. Perhaps it is Fernandes popularity desire that keeps him committed but at this stage, I have to put the blame game behind us and hope that they remain at least until we come out the other side of this. Then just when we hope that we are through the worst of it, FFP 17/18 raises its head and even if the shareholders want to buy more players they are shackled. From a business point of view the QPR situation is hardly attractive. So not only are we limited with which other manager we could attract, we are also limited in who on earth would acquire the club now.
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Post by harr on Jan 23, 2018 14:08:56 GMT
My point about going backwards only relates to the points the football team accumulate throughout the season Bow. I’m not suggesting here in any way or form that other things around the Club are not changing or going in a better direction or questioning that the current players don’t play with pride etc. My only point is again we are hovering just above the relegation zone for the second year. Should be be just happy we are not actually in the relegation zone or should we expect more in terms of points, wins, draws, away wins, clean sheets, even with FFP noose around us. I'm not saying we should be happy about it, I just find it tiring how it's just constant reiteration of it not being that good and the constant vague digs without any consideration of what else the club should be doing. Hey, it’s a messageboard we are allowed to discuss and dig surely. I think the whole board all hoped that IH would be doing a bit better and most of the board I feel want him to succeed too. He still has 18 more games to show us we are improving up the table, let’s hope he gets on with it. On a serious note, if we finish this season on 53 points again in May and avoid relegation again by say two points etc, how many on this board accept that’s a good enough season and we continue exactly the same next season with IH/MB. If come next January we are hovering just over relegation again (28 games , 33 pts) how many on here think that still would be ok. By then IH would have been in the job over 2 yrs and 2 months. All presumption this is of course, nothing more. I’m just curious.
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Post by sharky on Jan 23, 2018 14:43:58 GMT
It's become the thing on this board to say it's great we're "going for youth", "giving the youngsters a chance" and "bringing on our youth" rather than spending money to bring in proven players. I think if the dire FFP situation we are told we find ourselves in is to be believed then FFP has caused this move because we can't do anything else. In the last few weeks we've got shot of a heap of our youngsters and if those ITK are to be believed we will be getting rid of a whole heap more in the coming days. That in my book isn't bringing the youngsters on, it's us taking a gamble on a sh1t load of kids to see if the odd one could make their way into a Championship team. This is a recipe for getting us into League 1 or 2 if we're not careful IMO. We've gone from one extreme to another rather than a mixture of bringing on youth and buying in some proven players. Lessons learned. I don't think so.
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Post by Marc on Jan 23, 2018 15:00:25 GMT
It's become the thing on this board to say it's great we're "going for youth", "giving the youngsters a chance" and "bringing on our youth" rather than spending money to bring in proven players. I think if the dire FFP situation we are told we find ourselves in is to be believed then FFP has caused this move because we can't do anything else. In the last few weeks we've got shot of a heap of our youngsters and if those ITK are to be believed we will be getting rid of a whole heap more in the coming days. That in my book isn't bringing the youngsters on, it's us taking a gamble on a sh1t load of kids to see if the odd one could make their way into a Championship team. This is a recipe for getting us into League 1 or 2 if we're not careful IMO. We've gone from one extreme to another rather than a mixture of bringing on youth and buying in some proven players. Lessons learned. I don't think so. The problem was that we had way too many youngsters on the books that were never good enough at this level, moving them on can only be good for all concerned and would mean that those who are good enough have a much better chance.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2018 16:21:15 GMT
and people on here must remember it is other people's opinions... I personally would have not employed him to start with, I believe there was better options at that time.
We all blame FFP but we have a good quality squad with lots of ability in the players we have that just needs more coaching etc. You have got to admit that when we all play and give 100% its fantastic and we can beat any other team in this league. What we are lacking is a leader and its no good week in and week out having excuses, its about drive and commitment and wanting to play and win...
When can I apply for the job?
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Post by harr on Jan 23, 2018 16:43:52 GMT
I think what we lack more than anything is consistency
We can beat the best and lose to the worst which is so annoying.
We can put in a great performance backed up by a poor one.
We can even win two on the spin the go seven without winning.
For all the above you could argue because that’s the current League we are in , it’s that tough.
In the history of QPR there’s been much better teams and certainly worse, is the current Manager getting the best out of them, I honestly don’t know if he is, maybe not.
I love them to death but boy do they frustrate me at the minute.
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