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Post by rangerjake on Dec 14, 2016 20:03:40 GMT
16' in and we've had a couple of chances but (surprise, surprise) unable to convert.
Looks like 3 at the back with Perch and Bidwell playing as fullbacks?
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Post by londonranger on Dec 14, 2016 20:26:08 GMT
No score. Close to 40 mins.
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Post by londonranger on Dec 14, 2016 20:38:48 GMT
0-0 HT.
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Post by rangerjake on Dec 14, 2016 21:17:10 GMT
16' in and we've had a couple of chances but (surprise, surprise) unable to convert. Looks like 3 at the back with Perch and Bidwell playing as fullbacks? That would make 5 at the back. 3 at the back would mean Perch and Bidwell are playing as wing backs or should that be wide receivers According to commentary Hall is playing as a holding midfielder or some such thing. Still 0-0, our attack is really pathetic. Zero ability to actually put it in the back of the net. Not that we create THAT many chances but even when we do we miss or a "great save", according to our Twitter feed at least.
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Post by rangerjake on Dec 14, 2016 21:28:27 GMT
0-1..unbelievable, totally against the run of play.
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Post by rangerjake on Dec 14, 2016 21:35:28 GMT
There is something wrong with this CLUB not this TEAM in my opinion.
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Post by nomar on Dec 14, 2016 21:46:46 GMT
There is something wrong with this CLUB not this TEAM in my opinion. You only just noticed this? In fairness, it's better, much better, than it has been but certainly this is a team bereft of confidence right now. I kinda welcome relegation in a way at the moment, it may be the only thing that saves us.
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Dufster
Neil Warnock
I say!
Posts: 548
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Post by Dufster on Dec 14, 2016 22:40:37 GMT
Havent seen the posession stats but we must have a good 60% tonight. Did not derserve to lose Derby V lucky to walk away with 3 pts!!
Have to make some changes though - Washington, this lad has been given plenty of time to make an impact but at this point in the season I feel he should not be starting games,
For me he is out of his depth in the Championship - For starters Cant head the ball and he gets pushed of it far too easily,lacks any vision and hasnt got the skill required at this level to take on a beat a player! He showed that again tonight!!
Dosent track back or get stuck in his only talent seems to be to run like forest!!
Was much relieved to see Polter replace him...should have happened earlier IMO.
Same with Gladwin - did nothing when he came on and that has been consistent in every game I have seen him play in. Cant believe those 2 are worthy enough to wear our 9 and 11 shirts!!
We need bring in a strong charecter as Captain (would have Bidwell over the Cheif all day long) and we need a quality striker or we will struggle to not be in a relegation fight!
We did not deserve to lose tonight!!
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Post by bowranger on Dec 14, 2016 22:46:34 GMT
Just getting home, absolutely gutted. This was so, so much better than the Rotherham or Wolves game. People have already covered most of it. Wasn't perfect by any means - still found transitioning from the back to attack bitty (often a lack of movement), some weird thing where we don't seem to give options at throw ins up the pitch...but yeah, intent, effort, more chances. And then sucker punched. Hope Ollie can motivate them after this as they must be in bits.
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Post by bowranger on Dec 14, 2016 22:51:57 GMT
Also, broken record but feel it's a bit harsh on Washington. He's not a lone striker, he knows it and Ollie said as much in the press, but he tried his best out of position as Polter was coming back from injury.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2016 22:55:58 GMT
Just getting home, absolutely gutted. This was so, so much better than the Rotherham or Wolves game. People have already covered most of it. Wasn't perfect by any means - still found transitioning from the back to attack bitty (often a lack of movement), some weird thing where we don't seem to give options at throw ins up the pitch...but yeah, intent, effort, more chances. And then sucker punched. Hope Ollie can motivate them after this as they must be in bits. The motivation should've been to put in a decent performance after the Rotherham debacle , this wasn't a decent performance by any stretch so there is obviously a big problem . This is a very poor team and at the moment the worst in the division so it don't look good . Ferdinands signings looking extremely poor .
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Dufster
Neil Warnock
I say!
Posts: 548
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Post by Dufster on Dec 14, 2016 22:58:55 GMT
Also, broken record but feel it's a bit harsh on Washington. He's not a lone striker, he knows it and Ollie said as much in the press, but he tried his best out of position as Polter was coming back from injury. Just my opinion Bow but I think Ive seen enough to say he is not good enough for this level and no where near good enough to own the number 9 shirt no matter what the system or position!
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Post by harr on Dec 14, 2016 23:10:01 GMT
Looked a much better performance today but sadly the threat up front didnt seem great and some will say could have played another 90 minutes and still never scored. My other conclusion is that I first watched Gladwin play 16 months ago, thought he looked poor player then and still think he looks look a League One player now, which might be handy quite soon. Robbed of 2 Million. A better improvement but unless we start scoring, we keep dropping. Was really hoping Ollie gets more than 3 points from 15 I know form is just a word that you can juggle any way you like. The fact is in 10 matches only Rotherham, Wolves and Bristol C have picked up less than us and two of those have actually beaten us. Going to bed with hump again Come on Rangers, you can do better still.
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Post by bowranger on Dec 14, 2016 23:40:44 GMT
Also, broken record but feel it's a bit harsh on Washington. He's not a lone striker, he knows it and Ollie said as much in the press, but he tried his best out of position as Polter was coming back from injury. Just my opinion Bow but I think Ive seen enough to say he is not good enough for this level and no where near good enough to own the number 9 shirt no matter what the system or position!
That's fair enough mate. I think the irony is that I've probably been unimpressed most times I've watched him but that's mainly cos those times have been him on his todd up front. Even the old Posh chairman said we were wasting him doing that. Conversely, when he's been put on the left or off the shoulder of Polter I've been really impressed and think he makes us a lot more dangerous.
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Post by bowranger on Dec 15, 2016 10:59:47 GMT
Just getting home, absolutely gutted. This was so, so much better than the Rotherham or Wolves game. People have already covered most of it. Wasn't perfect by any means - still found transitioning from the back to attack bitty (often a lack of movement), some weird thing where we don't seem to give options at throw ins up the pitch...but yeah, intent, effort, more chances. And then sucker punched. Hope Ollie can motivate them after this as they must be in bits. The motivation should've been to put in a decent performance after the Rotherham debacle , this wasn't a decent performance by any stretch so there is obviously a big problem . This is a very poor team and at the moment the worst in the division so it don't look good . Ferdinands signings looking extremely poor . If you genuinely think that was a poor performance and emblematic of being the worst in the division then I'd probably keep away from LR and the Championship in general because you're going to be disappointed a lot. We held one of the best teams in this division for the majority of the game and could have won. A point was the least we deserved - more shots on goal, more shots on target, more possession. I'm not happy about the result either but I think you're selling us really short. Also, sorry for having a dig, but this whole Ferdinand's signing stuff isn't just opinion, it's ignorant and literally wrong. Les Ferdinand does not sign players. They are not his signings. He watches players with scouts based on the opinions of the scouts and the transfer targets of the manager. His job is a go-between that holds QPR to a strategy and budget - a bit of consistency when everything else is inconsistent. QPR managers do not last more than a year and we don't have the ability to finance the whims of every manager through the door because 1. Tony's itchy trigger finger combined with our fans obsession with new blood and 2. we've bloody done that with Redknapp, Hughes etc. and the money was pissed up the wall and it quite obviously does not work. With that in mind, Ferdinand is the one thinking about QPR signings 5 years ahead whereas a manager is thinking about signings for a season ahead, because that's how long we give managers. They aren't thinking about QPR's finances in 2020 and why should they? Look at that Derby team - Will Hughes, Darren Bent, Aaron Pearce, Tom Ince. Any of those players could walk into our team but in the current market we could barely afford even one of them. Sucks but that's how it is and frankly I don't know what else you want Ferdinand to do about it. If you reckon you could put together a half decent Championship team on that budget whilst cutting the wage bill and bending to the whim of various managers then I'd genuinely be interested to know how you or someone else would make a better fist of it. The alternative is that you turn the transfer budget over to Holloway, he bins off JFH's signings so we don't develop them (but they'll keep drawing a wage, so an utter waste of investment), he will layer on his own signings and then we'll do it allover again when Ollie is inevitably hounded out. And then you can come online after another loss and go on about how the signings are really poor and wonder why it isn't working. Probably boring the life out of people by repeating myself but this stuff really boils my piss. There is so much wrong with our club but one thing you can't fault them on is at least being a hell of a lot more transparent about what people at the club actually DO. There's multiple videos, interviews and articles freely available that explicitly explain what Ferdinand and Hoos etc. do at the club but no matter what, someone will come on and tar Ferdinand off with the same old crap about signings. Signings that he does not have the ability to greenlight without the manager's say so. It's conspiratorial, untrue and genuinely has an impact on the wider opinion of the support because the more people trot out this line, the more people believe it. It's not even just club PR - read LFW's take on it from meeting people at the club. Read Dave Mac's take on it. Genuinely saps the enthusiasm out of me. I have a s/t and go to as many away games as I can and have sat through players like Bosingwa, Assou-Akotto, Ji Sung Park etc. absolutely rob our club blind with a lack of effort on disgusting wages. The team we've got now are probably not that good, but they do try. They clearly have zero confidence, probably partly because playing at LR makes them feel like we hate most of them (players booed off the bench AGAIN yesterday). Players making a step-up, players who havn't played in this league before, players out of their proper positions, some players who are probably not quite up to it. They aren't blameless - the mental toughness we lack after going a goal down etc. is a big issue. But that's the club we are now and that's how we've had to buy. If they were not imperfect we wouldn't have been able to afford them. Frankly, it's rubbish that we have to take our financial medicine but if you gave me the choice of freezing to death in some northern away end watching Bosingwa take the absolute piss out of our club or Luongo tearing about and doing his best, then I'll take the latter every time thanks very much. If we had the budget to go and buy proven Championship promotion contenders, don't you think we'd do that? Do you think we're signing league one and rough gems from Europe for a laugh, to somehow deliberately be not very good? The results are really hard to take but I can tell you straight up that it's one thing coming out of a match and feeling absolutely gutted by our players standing up, having the best of the game and still losing - but it's quite another to have to then come online and see people who genuinely ONLY post after we've lost make really snide, untrue digs about the club and never give even a tiny modicum of credit when it's due. When we were shiteeee for most of our time in League One and in the financial bin it felt like the fans came together. Now we're facing a potentially similar future and it's the opposite. I really hate it.
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Post by Marc on Dec 15, 2016 12:35:39 GMT
I totally agree with all of that Bow. Plus while most are having a go about LF and our signings I take a different view. We actually signed some good players in the last 18 months but have not seen much of them at all for one reason or another - mostly injury but partly the constant changes in team and formation. We now have 2 good keepers a couple of decent centre halfs in Hall and Lynch a decent fullback in Bidwell who should be captain as he is the only who will open his mouth. In Midfield we have Luongo Chery Borysiuk Cousins, Wszoluk,. More attacking we have Washington who could do well if played alongside a good striker. We have Sylla who is a far better player than we have seen yet and a natural goal poacher/scorer and a good man in Ngbakoto. I have the advantage of having seen more of the last two with their previous clubs. That is not a bad base for a team and there are a couple of young players coming through like Shodipo. We have some weak spots and the names are obvious as I have not named them above. It is all about getting a settled balanced team, understanding and doing what they are capabable of and rebuilding confidence. The constant chopping and changing does nothing to rebuild confidence or team work imo. The area that worries me most is that Chery has created more goal chances than any other player in the Championship yet our conversion rate is about the lowest. This I believe is partly down to playing one up front for too long and secondly that Poulter appears to be our "star striker"; Sorry but I do not rate him anywhere near being a Championship player and that's the area we need to focus on in January along with a right back. I am not happy with the results but do believe we have the base of a good team and certainly are far from being the worst squad in the division or the worst squad we have had in recent times. Great post, I look forwards to kerrins ignoring it.
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Post by harr on Dec 15, 2016 14:08:15 GMT
I totally agree with all of that Bow. Plus while most are having a go about LF and our signings I take a different view. We actually signed some good players in the last 18 months but have not seen much of them at all for one reason or another - mostly injury but partly the constant changes in team and formation. We now have 2 good keepers a couple of decent centre halfs in Hall and Lynch a decent fullback in Bidwell who should be captain as he is the only who will open his mouth. In Midfield we have Luongo Chery Borysiuk Cousins, Wszoluk,. More attacking we have Washington who could do well if played alongside a good striker. We have Sylla who is a far better player than we have seen yet and a natural goal poacher/scorer and a good man in Ngbakoto. I have the advantage of having seen more of the last two with their previous clubs. That is not a bad base for a team and there are a couple of young players coming through like Shodipo. We have some weak spots and the names are obvious as I have not named them above. It is all about getting a settled balanced team, understanding and doing what they are capabable of and rebuilding confidence. The constant chopping and changing does nothing to rebuild confidence or team work imo. The area that worries me most is that Chery has created more goal chances than any other player in the Championship yet our conversion rate is about the lowest. This I believe is partly down to playing one up front for too long and secondly that Poulter appears to be our "star striker"; Sorry but I do not rate him anywhere near being a Championship player and that's the area we need to focus on in January along with a right back. I am not happy with the results but do believe we have the base of a good team and certainly are far from being the worst squad in the division or the worst squad we have had in recent times. I agree with most of these points but.... We cant blame it on injuries, thats just old news surely 57 , every squad has those. If those players are so good and Im one of the ones that thinks most are good. Even when the good players were available every week, JFH wasnt even playing them all. (I will remove Gladwin and El Kyati from my so called good ones or good enough squad players though ) How come after half another season we are performing so badly, the last 2-3 months we are relegation form and the start of the season and last season mid table form. Whats the root of the problem then . If its not the owners, not the Managers, not the players and not Les's fault, the blame has to fall somewhere surely? We will be consolidating for 5 seasons at this rate. Its just a word for underperforming and underachieving now surely ? Not once since we have been relegated has our defence looked good enough to keep a clean sheet and its never been sorted since Ramsey run the show. Why not? Every Manager at every club messes with formations every week, I see as no different than other teams. I think when you get a winning team keeping things tight at the back you keep it, sadly we have never had this. Anyhow Injuries are injuries and and our poor form, ie 21st in 24 teams over 10 games is not all down to injuries in my little world.
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Post by harr on Dec 15, 2016 15:42:08 GMT
I am not blaming the performances on injuries. My post was purely about the quality of our signings. My point on injuries is simply that we have not seen much of some of our new signings because of injuries, for example Ngbakoto who has hardly featured but from what I have heard has started to get up to speed with the championship quickly with a couple of games under his belt and I expect the same will happen with Borysiuk and Cousins will improve again if they can get fully fit and playing together. Criticism is being raised about some of our signings when fans have not seen them play more than a few minutes and certainly have not seen them play together. The root of the problem is that we are not performing well enough to be higher in the table at the moment, for a combination of internal reasons plus the fact that there are 23 other teams who all want to be better than they are. It is impossible to blame one person or factor for how a team is doing - it is all down to collective responsibility. If consolidation takes 5 years so be it - that is not extraordinary. I would dispute anyone who claims that consolidation means turning a relegated club in our situation into a Premier League team within a year or two. The first and major step of consolidation is to stop the rot and nothing more. After that comes progression. These days when things are not going well it seems the first reaction of many fans and owners is to look to instantly "blame" someone and expect a quick fix. When we are not doing well the most important thing is support for the team not the blame game and constant criticism. reading that Ollie is being called a liar because he said he saw some positives in our last 2 performances is just sick in my opinion. Some good points. What internal reasons ?? I guess my consoldation would be like last season finishing mid table, winning a few losing a few. Yet we bought better players and went backwards. I like Ollie, always will, but did not see one positive against Rotherham, we didnt score against a dreadful defence, we didnt keep a clean sheet against a dreadful team and we were the first team to get beaten by them for 15-16 games. I fail to see how anyone can get a positive from that result apart from the 11 players walked off the pitch uninjured.
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Post by kerrins on Dec 15, 2016 17:48:45 GMT
Fabs matey not trying to ignore just digest. Unfortunate to concede a very late goal and get no points from the game. Shame. Yes indeed some very well reasoned insight by Bowranger/57 varieties about the Club and its current circumstances. I can agree with a lot of it. However the bee in my bonnet over the last 18 months... not 18 days... or 18 weeks(and I don't wish to be waiting 18 years to wait for a return to the Premiership. Might not last that long )is purely about our woeful transfer strategy and the quality of players we have been signing. I will always try and give credit where credit is due and am not blind to the financial cloud the club is currently under. There have been some games this season where this squad have won well. Against Leeds. Cardiff and Bristol City for example. We are not the worst team in this league and I have said all along even going back to the days when Ramsey was manager we will not get relegated from the Championship . There should easily be three teams worse than us this season. Sorry but I do take issue with any opinion that expounds the view that QPR FC since the summer of 2015 have had and continue to have a good squad of players. Certainly you would not likely have heard that phrase from any of us that were at Rotherham on Saturday!! True one game but I have been looking at a bigger picture and more long term trends rather than a knee jerk reaction. I make it 27 players signed. It may even be 28 now if the Bolton Wanderers discard Alex Finney has joined up. How many Good Standard Championship players amongst that lot? Although I just cant get my head round the viewpoint that says we have a good squad amazingly there remains some expert journalistic opinion and some supporters mantra (much eroded by now surely?) that goes along with this! Eh? Where is the evidence M'Lud At present we seem to be in a spiral of decline and it hurts me. In future Ollie will have to be shrewd in the transfer market(with the backing of our DOF of course ) if matters are to improve
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Post by Marc on Dec 15, 2016 20:47:46 GMT
Fabs matey not trying to ignore just digest. Unfortunate to concede a very late goal and get no points from the game. Shame. Yes indeed some very well reasoned insight by Bowranger/57 varieties about the Club and its current circumstances. I can agree with a lot of it. However the bee in my bonnet over the last 18 months... not 18 days... or 18 weeks(and I don't wish to be waiting 18 years to wait for a return to the Premiership. Might not last that long )is purely about our woeful transfer strategy and the quality of players we have been signing. I will always try and give credit where credit is due and am not blind to the financial cloud the club is currently under. There have been some games this season where this squad have won well. Against Leeds. Cardiff and Bristol City for example. We are not the worst team in this league and I have said all along even going back to the days when Ramsey was manager we will not get relegated from the Championship . There should easily be three teams worse than us this season. Sorry but I do take issue with any opinion that expounds the view that QPR FC since the summer of 2015 have had and continue to have a good squad of players. Certainly you would not likely have heard that phrase from any of us that were at Rotherham on Saturday!! True one game but I have been looking at a bigger picture and more long term trends rather than a knee jerk reaction. I make it 27 players signed. It may even be 28 now if the Bolton Wanderers discard Alex Finney has joined up. How many Good Standard Championship players amongst that lot? Although I just cant get my head round the viewpoint that says we have a good squad amazingly there remains some expert journalistic opinion and some supporters mantra (much eroded by now surely?) that goes along with this! Eh? Where is the evidence M'Lud At present we seem to be in a spiral of decline and it hurts me. In future Ollie will have to be shrewd in the transfer market(with the backing of our DOF of course ) if matters are to improve Your points have been replied to in many a thread but you do tend to ignore, go away the repost exactly he same thing later on down the line. It's been explained that the transfer strategy has been far from woeful and that, given the restraint, some good players have been signed. Those players have been listed above (and in other threads) but you continually refuse to even acknowledge those posts or even explain to us why you think those players listed are dross (to use your word).
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Post by rangerjake on Dec 15, 2016 21:39:34 GMT
Fabs matey not trying to ignore just digest. Unfortunate to concede a very late goal and get no points from the game. Shame. Yes indeed some very well reasoned insight by Bowranger/57 varieties about the Club and its current circumstances. I can agree with a lot of it. However the bee in my bonnet over the last 18 months... not 18 days... or 18 weeks(and I don't wish to be waiting 18 years to wait for a return to the Premiership. Might not last that long )is purely about our woeful transfer strategy and the quality of players we have been signing. I will always try and give credit where credit is due and am not blind to the financial cloud the club is currently under. There have been some games this season where this squad have won well. Against Leeds. Cardiff and Bristol City for example. We are not the worst team in this league and I have said all along even going back to the days when Ramsey was manager we will not get relegated from the Championship . There should easily be three teams worse than us this season. Sorry but I do take issue with any opinion that expounds the view that QPR FC since the summer of 2015 have had and continue to have a good squad of players. Certainly you would not likely have heard that phrase from any of us that were at Rotherham on Saturday!! True one game but I have been looking at a bigger picture and more long term trends rather than a knee jerk reaction. I make it 27 players signed. It may even be 28 now if the Bolton Wanderers discard Alex Finney has joined up. How many Good Standard Championship players amongst that lot? Although I just cant get my head round the viewpoint that says we have a good squad amazingly there remains some expert journalistic opinion and some supporters mantra (much eroded by now surely?) that goes along with this! Eh? Where is the evidence M'Lud At present we seem to be in a spiral of decline and it hurts me. In future Ollie will have to be shrewd in the transfer market(with the backing of our DOF of course ) if matters are to improve Your points have been replied to in many a thread but you do tend to ignore, go away the repost exactly he same thing later on down the line. It's been explained that the transfer strategy has been far from woeful and that, given the restraint, some good players have been signed. Those players have been listed above (and in other threads) but you continually refuse to even acknowledge those posts or even explain to us why you think those players listed are dross (to use your word). What bothers me most is not so much the players, but that I never feel week to week like we have a plan or a style of play that we are working to execute. I'm sure I watched an interview with the Ferdinand/Hoos/JFH triad at the start of the season and it was explained that we wanted to have a way of playing and then pursue that no matter who the manager is. We would recruit players who fit that system, train all of our youth teams to play that way and then there would be a consistency throughout the organization ( a la Swansea or Southampton) and this would serve us well through the ups and downs of whatever league we find ourselves and the general uncertainty of football. So when it came time to decide if JFH had to go I felt like it wasn't a binary decision..simply good or bad. You could sack JFH and have it be good or bad depending on who you hire to replace him. If you're following this "style of play" mantra then you would hire another manager who played that way, I believe the style in our case was playing the pressing game, up tempo, really fit players? Am I right? I'm not sure if Ollie fits this style or what his history is, does he play this kind of football? If he doesn't then we start to fall into the trap of signing a whole gaggle of players every transfer window to fit in with the new manager, and the never ending cycle of waiting for them to bed in, giving them six to nine months and if it doesn't work we sack the manager and hire another guy who plays ANOTHER way and the cycle continues. If on the other hand we follow this plan that was set forth at the beginning of the year then I'm a little more optimistic.
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