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Post by Marc on Aug 7, 2020 16:21:52 GMT
Talking of BOS
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Post by Marc on Aug 7, 2020 16:22:41 GMT
"QPR plan to reopen contract talks with Bright Osayi-Samuel after he rejected a move to Club Brugge.
The Belgian outfit recently had a £4.7m bid for Osayi-Samuel accepted but he stalled over the transfer and asked for time to make a decision.
And the winger has now decided that he does not want to make the move.
QPR and the player himself have been hoping that Club Brugge’s offer being accepted would lead to English clubs coming in for him.
Several Premier League and Championship sides have been linked with Osayi-Samuel but none have made an approach.
Crystal Palace, who want QPR’s Ebere Eze, have been considering matching Club Brugge’s offer for Osayi-Samuel but have so far not done so.
In February, Rangers triggered options to extend the contracts of Osayi-Samuel and Ryan Manning – both players’ deals were due to expire this summer.
Osayi-Samuel rejected the club’s offers of a longer-term contract, prompting QPR to accept an improved bid from Club Brugge, who previously had an offer of £3m rejected.
Contract talks between Rangers and Osayi-Samuel were called off on the understanding he would be moving on.
But he will be invited to resume discussions when the R’s squad report for pre-season training next week.
However, so far there has been no indication from the Osayi-Samuel camp that he intends to commit his long-term future to the club.
Manning has similarly kept his options open, although talks with his representatives are continuing.
The Irishman has been linked with several clubs but so far there has been no sign of any concrete interest.
Meanwhile, Crystal Palace and West Ham remain the only clubs to have made approaches for Eze despite others being linked with the forward.
And QPR remain keen to wrap up a deal to sign Luke Amos from Tottenham on a permanent deal."
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Post by powerpump on Aug 8, 2020 7:30:03 GMT
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Post by hitmanrangers on Aug 8, 2020 7:40:36 GMT
Lets get this done with West Ham - £12M plus Hugill and Winston Reid + sell on clause.
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Post by bowranger on Aug 8, 2020 9:50:05 GMT
Keep trying to pick this one apart, there's definitely a lot of opinions about it online. If it's in WLS, we can semi-assume the club, BOS (well, his agent) or both want us to know about the situation. Does this send a message to English clubs that BOS is still available, wants to stay in the country, but you'll need to come get him soon or he'll sign back up and cost you more? There's so many motivations involved and outcomes that could be great or crap for us. BOS is keeping his options open but that in the short term costs him money. As LFW points out, he chose not to sign an improved deal with us last time. That's arguably sensible for BOS with clubs sniffing around - keeps his value down with a year left, opens the door for more money via sign on fees and wages (and crucially gets his agent paid, hence their apparent enthusiasm for the Brugges deal). But in the short term, that loses him money. Every day after he refused the deal QPR offered is money left on the table - he could be pocketing more money than he is right now. He's already 'lost' potentially a hundred grand or so in wages having refused our offer. Compared to Prem money, not a big deal. If a bigger club come in this window, he'll make that 'shortfall' up in a matter of months. But now BOS has a better look at the reality of the clubs available to him, he has got a decision to make and part of that has to be down to how well he reckons he is going to do next year. Dream scenario for us (in my opinion) is either we get a big cash offer for him this window, or maybe even better, he signs an extension on better money and if he tears up the Championship next season, he is the 'new Eze' and has his pick of the clubs next summer (or potentially even January). A less good scenario is that he doesn't sign a new year deal, decides he definitely wants to move on and a club he prefers comes in late in the window for less than our valuation without competition. In that scenario, he still gets his move and plenty of cash (agent too) but we are forced into a Charlie Austin situation - take the money now even if it isn't what we hoped for or risk him going for next to nothing in January (or literally nothing next Summer). That last part is the worst case scenario for me - that the interest this window isn't enough for BOS to want to move, but he runs his contract down and is open to a big pool of interest on a free next Summer. My only hope is that he really backs himself and we manage this as well as we can. In many ways, the club is screwed to some extent either way- 90% of the power is with the player, agent and offering clubs. We can only offer him so much of a raise within our wage structure and first team football. Even on a new deal and a good next season, he won't be out of the price range of Prem clubs anyway, so if he doesn't go this summer, I'd be desperate he signs a new deal. Drives up his own value and opens up better options for him, but also us. Or in short, I haven't got a clue.
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Post by hitmanrangers on Aug 8, 2020 10:56:50 GMT
I think the transfer deadline has been extended to mid October, so 6-8 games into the season, maybe a late deal would not be too bad? They play a bit for us, hopefully help to give us a decent start, and then leave? Or maybe they won't want to play for fear of injury although Eze and BOS don't come across as having that attitude in their makeup. Ideally we get deals done early but they come back to pre-season next week so expect deals to happen late August. Of course, the owners might risk consider a short term loan into the company to fund deals early, then get repaid when sales go through later? Certainly that looks the case if we are prepared to spend money on Goode/Dickie, and Amos, which would likely be £2M+ outlay and we don't have that sort of spare cash around at the moment.
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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 8, 2020 11:44:13 GMT
Agree with the above. It all becomes something of a game of poker. QPR are in for quite a few players and if we sell BOS or Eze then fine. But if not...... The club has done its best to talk up interest and get a deal over the line, but that will only happen at a discount it seems. I suspect that if we do not receive an increased bid for Eze then we will accept Palace's offer rather than lose out on essential new recruits. The current press statements may well be saying, if you do not bid now, you could miss out. But I do not see anything to suggest that BOS would even consider signing an extended deal. It is a short passage of time until the January window this season by which time, the club's position will be pretty desperate. I know that players today do not need to demonstrate loyalty to any club, but it would be pleasing if BOS respected the progress he has made at QPR and encouraged a deal to see his old club(s) compensated.
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Post by Ashdown_Ranger on Aug 8, 2020 12:09:24 GMT
...or in short, I haven't got a clue.
Like the rest of us!
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Post by bowranger on Aug 8, 2020 12:21:44 GMT
...or in short, I haven't got a clue.
Like the rest of us! Haha for sure. From posts above, a lot of this seems to rest on our level of confidence on any deal (below expectations or not) for BOS and Eze materialising and how much we actually have made available for transfers- which is the big unknown. Yes, it's fair to assume that players need to go out before players come in - the club have said as much. Difference is whether the confidence is there about deals this window. For example, do we feasibly have the capital to temporarily sew up, say, Goode or Amos or whoever a potential striker could be, on the basis that we know the money to balance it out will come in a few weeks later? Other issue is, again similar to how complex the circumstances were that lead to the Austin sale, that we probably can't have it both ways. There are definitive gaps that need filling. Even ignoring Eze and BOS going or not, there needs to be a striker and CB as the bare minimum in through the door. So say we take the rumoured current Palace offer for Eze - yes, that is below what I reckon he's worth. But by comparative value, is it better to take that if it is the only one on the table if that is the absolute defining difference in us not starting the season without a new striker or CB? That's when it gets dicey, particularly when the window extends over the start of the season when points are at stake.
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Post by Ashdown_Ranger on Aug 8, 2020 12:30:18 GMT
Just had a thought - though not thought through in the slightest...
But, what if transfer fees were done away with entirely and the 'selling' club received a percentage (for argument's sake, 25%) of the player's new salary from the 'buying club'?
With no transfer fee to pay, and to compensate for the slice going to the parent club, headline player salaries would increase quite a bit .
So if Eze went to Spurs at £250k per week on a three year contract, QPR would receive £62,500 a week for those 3 years - £9.75m.
If we signed Hugil on £40k a week on a three year contract, West Ham would receive £10,000 per week from QPR for 3 years - £1.56m.
It could put an end to massively unaffordable transfer fees and, involving no up-front costs, even-out clubs' cash-flow problems.
A possible route to more sustainable football?
I'm sure someone will shoot this down in flames...
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Post by bowranger on Aug 8, 2020 21:06:36 GMT
That theory...I have no idea.
But one thing on BOS I've seen banded about that I hadn't thought to factor in is a release clause. Would a middle way, if there isn't a club that BOS is keen on this window, be to encourage him to sign a moderately approved deal with a release clause that still ensures we get paid but is still competitive and affordable for a Prem side in the future..?
He makes cash he otherwise would miss out on if he ran his deal down. We become less likely to lose him without a fee, gives both sides a degree of security. And for the right figure, if more than one club come in for him for the release clause amount, the fight becomes about signing on fees and new wages, so he wins there too.
I am sure this is too simple and there is a massive downside I'm probably missing.? But I don't hate that idea on paper.
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Post by bowranger on Aug 9, 2020 12:21:31 GMT
That theory...I have no idea. But one thing on BOS I've seen banded about that I hadn't thought to factor in is a release clause. Would a middle way, if there isn't a club that BOS is keen on this window, be to encourage him to sign a moderately approved deal with a release clause that still ensures we get paid but is still competitive and affordable for a Prem side in the future..? He makes cash he otherwise would miss out on if he ran his deal down. We become less likely to lose him without a fee, gives both sides a degree of security. And for the right figure, if more than one club come in for him for the release clause amount, the fight becomes about signing on fees and new wages, so he wins there too. I am sure this is too simple and there is a massive downside I'm probably missing.? But I don't hate that idea on paper. Not a bad idea but I can see one potentially big downside. If BOS (or rather his agent) says we will just run down his current contract he will lose a certain amount of income until the next window or next summer but then as a free agent he (and his agent) can pick up substantial signing on fees for a free transfer. Of course that is a gamble for them as well but if it's case of lose a million in wages over the next 9 months but then pick up a 2 million signing on fee BOS will be happy, and Palace or whoever would be happy to pick him up for that 2 million signing on fee instead of paying close to 5 million for a transfer. in that scenario we would lose the transfer fee but have BOS for another season - frankly I prefer the cash now and re-invest a bit to fill some gaps in the squad. But in that scenario BOS would have to keeping being committed on the pitch or potentially lose his value and potential signing on fee - and if he does not want to perform let him train on his own and watch his value drop day by day. The players and agents always have the upper hand in these negotiations but a bit of straight hard talk on the realities from Hoos would do no harm and maybe push BOS out quicker. It would be interesting to know why he turned down playing for the Belgian Champions and the chance of Champions League football. Money? No guarantee of playing?, home sick? stupidity? Yeah there is truth in that - difference comes in what you set a release clause at and how much he backs himself. Cos the other side of that is, his value could just as easily rise. People deny it, but I remember on other sites and at away games, people did not feel about BOS the way they feel about him now. It was always that he looked alright, but raw - there were criticisms of his final ball, decision making and short temper to name a few (have to be honest...I quite liked the latter, even though it did trigger some silly yellow cards). But the BOS we saw after his showing at Birmingham away? That's the one we are now scared of losing for less than a few million. Warburton deserves a lot of credit for that and ditto Manning - what figures could we potentially be looking at if McClaren gave them proper, managed, runs in the team? As an aside, this is why the 'project' takes so many years. If McClaren was here, Chair almost certainly would be in league one on loan. But instead, he has another year of Championship football to bulk up his future value, rather than the situation with BOS and Manning where we have a year less of Championship regular footy on their CVs to boost their value, with a year less on their remaining contracts. As it stands, BOS' value is based on being great in league one at Blackpool and arguably being great for more than half a season at Championship level - the rest at this level has been patchy. But if he backs himself to keep improving, he'd be more valuable with a another season of tearing up the Championship. I mean valuable in terms of desirability for more clubs - the actual value in terms of cash is dependent on him signing a new deal, of course. So my point is, yeah, he could definitely run down his deal and get frozen out - but I also havn't seen anything in him to suggest he would do that unless we denied him a move or if we were bloody minded, which doesn't seem Warbs' style. He could just run his deal down. But feasibly, he could just get more money now and get an even better deal from more interested clubs come next summer cos another good season at this level only makes him more attractive. Plus in the money markets we swim in, it is still peanuts to a Premier League club. 2m or 8m makes a huge difference to us, but it is sod all to West Ham or Palace or whoever else. The only reason I think that is a potential, if unlikely, route for him is because of your last point. It seems like the only serious offer that came in was from Club Brugges. I don't know what is in his head but to me, it just feels like keeping your options open. Yeah, some early rounds Champions League football, but it is uprooting himself away from his friends and family, new country, new league, no players he already knows. He has a year's guarantee in place for first team football and getting paid. The English clubs he thought would come in for him havn't materialised yet. So my guess is...why move country now when a deal for a Prem team could still happen? If not this window, almost certainly if he tears the Championship a new one next year. As you say, release clause, new deal or not, that year of 'missed earnings' turns to dust the moment he gets a Prem signing on fee.
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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 9, 2020 12:55:15 GMT
All good stuff, but there is the additional point that if we fail to sell him this window and then 2 games in to the new season he could pick up a bad injury. Not good for him, but pretty terrible for the club. That is why, unless he signs and extension, he has to leave this window for what ever we can get IMHO.
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Post by bowranger on Aug 9, 2020 15:03:31 GMT
All good stuff, but there is the additional point that if we fail to sell him this window and then 2 games in to the new season he could pick up a bad injury. Not good for him, but pretty terrible for the club. That is why, unless he signs and extension, he has to leave this window for what ever we can get IMHO. Without an extension, definitely. Part of me feels like (unless you're dealing with someone with a patchy injury record) it would normally be a risk worth taking. But if incomings depend on income and there's a risk he goes for nowt, it is probably how we have to think.
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Post by bowranger on Aug 9, 2020 19:19:51 GMT
All good talking points but bottom line is we have no idea what is going on. Pity is, as seems usual when we hit a transfer window, instead of discussing who we would like to bring in we just get stuck debating on the one or two players who want to leave. I can understand them wanting to leave to better themselves and have no problem with that. It is just frustrating that due to our financial situation the whole immediate future of the squad and our immediate prospects are dependent on that happens to players who do not want to stay here. We need a bit more ying - yang balance here. True true. But have to admit, I'm still kinda revelling in actually having players who people want to buy haha. It's been a rarity, least in my adult life. Don't get me wrong, I hate seeing these kind of players go, ideal world we'd polish them up and build a team round them. But seeing us take kids dumped by academies, rough gems from league one and the league of Ireland and see them blossom into players who could end up at the highest level is exciting. Beats bloody Bosingwa and Ji Sung Park at least.
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Post by harr on Aug 9, 2020 20:18:03 GMT
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Post by sharky on Aug 10, 2020 6:04:40 GMT
From Talk Sport talksport.com/football/efl/743206/championship-transfer-news-qpr-close-agreement-tottenham-luke-amos/QPR close to finalising permanent deal with Tottenham for midfielder Luke AmosBy talkSPORT 7th August 2020, 5:17 pm QPR are close to reaching an agreement with Tottenham over the permanent signing of midfielder Luke Amos. Amos, 23, spent the 2019/20 campaign at the Championship outfit, where he struck up a close relationship with manager Mark Warburton. QPR are confident of wrapping up a permanent deal for Amos Warburton has identified Amos as one of his primary targets in this transfer window, with Middlesbrough boss Neil Warnock also expressing an interest in signing the Spurs academy graduate. A serious knee injury curtailed Amos’s pathway to the Tottenham first team in 2018 just when he appeared to be forging himself into then Spurs boss Mauricio Pochettino’s first-team plans. talkSPORT understands that the two clubs are finalising a deal, with Spurs likely to receive a nominal fee for Amos – whose current contract expires next summer. A defensive midfielder by trade, Amos was an ever-present for the Rs last season making 34 appearances across all competitions.
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Post by terryb on Aug 10, 2020 8:34:41 GMT
It may be total b******s, but I have read that Amos has been part of a group of our players that have been on holiday together - Amos, BOS, Chair, Eze, Manning & Shodipo.
This, of coutse, would be no different to a group of friends or work mates going together, but it might indicate a togetherness that I would sugest is rare in professional foorball.
I'm sure friendship would have no bearing on whether a player is to leave the club, but it might slightly raise the bar on what a player would require from a purchasing club.
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Post by Marc on Aug 10, 2020 10:40:54 GMT
It may be total b******s, but I have read that Amos has been part of a group of our players that have been on holiday together - Amos, BOS, Chair, Eze, Manning & Shodipo. This, of coutse, would be no different to a group of friends or work mates going together, but it might indicate a togetherness that I would sugest is rare in professional foorball. I'm sure friendship would have no bearing on whether a player is to leave the club, but it might slightly raise the bar on what a player would require from a purchasing club. As long as it was not a farewell party for those leaving the club. We could build a decent attractive team around those 5 with some added experience. On a different note Sky are reporting that Stoke have pulled out of the attempts to sign Kieffer Moore from Wigan. That's ok for us on the face of it but the Stoke manager gives the reason for pulling out as he is unwilling to give into payment demands from players and only wants players with the right attitude who want to play for the club........food for thought maybe I thought Moore was going to sign for Cardiff.
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Post by bowranger on Aug 10, 2020 12:21:57 GMT
It may be total b******s, but I have read that Amos has been part of a group of our players that have been on holiday together - Amos, BOS, Chair, Eze, Manning & Shodipo. This, of coutse, would be no different to a group of friends or work mates going together, but it might indicate a togetherness that I would sugest is rare in professional foorball. I'm sure friendship would have no bearing on whether a player is to leave the club, but it might slightly raise the bar on what a player would require from a purchasing club. Definitely the case, decent sized group of them all in Mykonos together. They're all sharing photos of eachother on Instagram, it's quite sweet really. Does bode well on the togetherness. Would toss in that cos of the lockdown training etc, they'd all be in the same 'bubble', so would be a way for them to go on holiday with mates while adhering to pandemic rules.
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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 10, 2020 12:50:50 GMT
It may be total b******s, but I have read that Amos has been part of a group of our players that have been on holiday together - Amos, BOS, Chair, Eze, Manning & Shodipo. This, of coutse, would be no different to a group of friends or work mates going together, but it might indicate a togetherness that I would sugest is rare in professional foorball. I'm sure friendship would have no bearing on whether a player is to leave the club, but it might slightly raise the bar on what a player would require from a purchasing club. Definitely the case, decent sized group of them all in Mykonos together. They're all sharing photos of eachother on Instagram, it's quite sweet really. Does bode well on the togetherness. Would toss in that cos of the lockdown training etc, they'd all be in the same 'bubble', so would be a way for them to go on holiday with mates while adhering to pandemic rules. It also explains why things on the transfer front are so quiet. Most of the noise comes from agents, but the players do have to meet with the club and put their X at the bottom on the contract. Amos can hardly sign for us when he is on holiday. But with clubs due to report back next week, I would think the majority of players are 'holidaying' right now. We need to pray that there is no sudden outbreak of Covid in Mykonos because the last thing the club needs is a 14 day quarantine on their return.
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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 10, 2020 12:55:46 GMT
I thought Moore was going to sign for Cardiff. Thats what the Welsh newspapers and Cardiff were saying a week ago and before that at one time we were favourites to sign him. Wigan are desperate to move him as they need the cash and the administrators have to take the best offer. I have no evidence or support but my guess is that Moore knows he is being sold on the cheap due to Wigans situation so is trying play one club against another to get a signing on fee or increased salary. I think that we dropped out of this chase pretty early on. All the signs are that Moore is holding out for a sweetheart deal, The Administrator will want him gone, but if the player refuses to sign....... So it smacks of player power and going to the highest bidder of personal terms. Certainly, the Stoke feedback would suggest that he would be a poor cultural fit with our current squad philosophy.
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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 10, 2020 13:38:51 GMT
QPR discuss another loan deal for Hugill By West London Sport 10/08/2020
QPR: Jordan Hugill QPR are discussing another loan deal for Jordan Hugill after West Ham indicated they would want a sizeable transfer fee.
Hugill scored 15 goals for Rangers last season while on loan from the Hammers. He has no future at the London Stadium and is expected to be playing in the Championship again next season.
QPR would like to sign him on a permanent basis and are keen for any deal with West Ham for Ebere Eze to include Hugill moving in part exchange.
The east London club have indicated they are strongly interested in signing Rangers’ player of the year.
But with no firm offer from them for Eze, and with Rangers looking to get Hugill back well before the start of next season, QPR have explored the possibility of signing the 28-year-old striker outright.
However, West Ham paid Preston around £8m for Hugill in January 2018 and have made it clear want to recoup as much of that fee as possible.
It has therefore quickly become apparent that a permanent transfer is out of QPR’s reach unless a deal involving Eze is agreed.
Rangers are now looking to secure another season-long loan move for Hugill, who has two years remaining on his West Ham contract.
A deal to sign Luke Amos, who was also on loan, from Tottenham, has proved to be less complicated and has been in the pipeline for some time.
Midfielder Amos, 23, is expected to be a QPR player by the time the squad report for pre-season training next week.
So too is Eze despite ongoing speculation over his future.
Several clubs have been linked with him but the only concrete interest so far has been from Crystal Palace and West Ham.
The only offer made has been for £12m from Palace and was rejected.
Palace see no reason to make an improved bid at this stage as they are aware that theirs is the only offer on the table.
QPR need other clubs to come in for Eze in order to spark the kind of auction which could take his price towards the £20m mark.
Eze’s contract is due to expire next year but Rangers hold an option to extend it by 12 months, meaning he is effectively under contract until 2022.7https://www.westlondonsport.com/qpr/qpr-jordan-hugill-west-ham-ebere-eze-update-loan-100820
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Post by rickyqpr on Aug 10, 2020 13:41:40 GMT
As the above is from WLS, I think we can take it that the chances of Eze going to West Ham have now significantly dropped. Any Hugill deal will be distanced it seems - and only a loan. I am ok with that.
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Post by nomar on Aug 10, 2020 14:25:11 GMT
Things won’t take off for a while yet, then it will all be a last minute scramble on deadline day.
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Post by bowranger on Aug 10, 2020 15:02:46 GMT
As the above is from WLS, I think we can take it that the chances of Eze going to West Ham have now significantly dropped. Any Hugill deal will be distanced it seems - and only a loan. I am ok with that. Yeah same really. The fact West Ham would have to swallow a big chunk of wages would make any combined deal very messy.
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Post by Ashdown_Ranger on Aug 10, 2020 17:09:10 GMT
'Lancs Live' is reporting that Warnock is after Kieffer Moore for Middlesbrough and that the 'battle' for his signature is between Cardiff and Boro.
With WLS reporting the likely return of Hugill on loan, that would seem to be that in terms of our interest in Moore. Could certainly do without money demands upsetting the squad...
As for our speed of getting players over the line (or lack of it), well, I think things will start to take off once players are back in training. I also think Warburton is the kind of manager who wants his squad together early for the pre-season, and I get the feeling things won't go to a last-minute, final day frenzy.
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Post by gladstoneparkranger on Aug 11, 2020 1:14:41 GMT
Hull going for Jack Marriott as in last year of contract .. thought he looked good but not now rated by Cocu. Lampard regulary played him and puts himself about with good eye for goal. Goode gone quiet but fancy this deal is done and dusted and first signing announcement for this new thing at HQ
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Post by Ashdown_Ranger on Aug 11, 2020 7:36:20 GMT
Hull going for Jack Marriott as in last year of contract .. thought he looked good but not now rated by Cocu. Lampard regulary played him and puts himself about with good eye for goal. Goode gone quiet but fancy this deal is done and dusted and first signing announcement for this new thing at HQ Sky say Boro have just made an improved offer to sign Goode also they are back in for Moore. Why do I think Warnock thinks we have a decent eye for talent and is going to try to outbid us on any potential developing talent we go for. Saves him hiring his own scouts. To add to your theory, I've just read this:
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Post by Ashdown_Ranger on Aug 11, 2020 10:49:08 GMT
Given Warnock's luck (or lack of it) in buying strikers, maybe Moore's not that great - an ageing £1.1m* Rob Hulse anyone...?? *Signed in 2010 - according to various stat sources, in football-specific inflationary terms, he would cost £9-11m in today's money.
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