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Post by Ashdown_Ranger on Nov 21, 2019 19:09:25 GMT
I'll start this off with some team news (from Brent and Kilburn Times).
Have to say, I'm pleased/relieved Mitrovic is out...
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Post by tightattheback on Nov 22, 2019 19:45:19 GMT
Where’s Liam Kelly? Haven’t see any reports of him being injured!
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Post by nomar on Nov 22, 2019 20:05:58 GMT
We need a 2nd goal here. Fulham are all over the shop.
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Post by nomar on Nov 22, 2019 20:15:46 GMT
Which was why we needed a 2nd goal.
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Post by rickyqpr on Nov 22, 2019 20:35:04 GMT
Where’s Liam Kelly? Haven’t see any reports of him being injured! Injured for up to 6 weeks but was not far off for selection again today
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Post by rickyqpr on Nov 22, 2019 20:36:56 GMT
We conceded the same goal as usual. Manning loses out on a tackle, player cuts in and crosses from their right wing unchallenged and a header for our clean sheet to go out of the window again. We were so good until we conceded.....................doh!
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Post by londonranger on Nov 22, 2019 21:06:39 GMT
Lumley in goal. Will he save us?
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Post by nomar on Nov 22, 2019 21:14:32 GMT
Which is why we needed a 2nd goal.
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Post by londonranger on Nov 22, 2019 21:20:16 GMT
S----t Lumley made a woeful clearance. Spot on Nomar. Why cant we find a reasonably good goalkeeper.
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Post by londonranger on Nov 22, 2019 21:41:13 GMT
We lost 2-1
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Post by harr on Nov 22, 2019 21:45:53 GMT
Warburtons talk of us being more clinical fell on deaf ears then. Poor defending and more poor goalkeeping from Lumley. Oh well we started off well, 2 points from 15 now, falling down the table pretty swiftly.
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Post by egranger on Nov 22, 2019 23:17:02 GMT
Yes we have once again conceded two poor goals but for me there were plenty of positives in defeat for me. We should have been three nil up after twenty minutes with some brilliant play We didn’t give up and could easily have snuck an equaliser in the last ten minutes. If we start like this against Forest we could be in for a treat on Wednesday night at the Bush.
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Post by bowranger on Nov 23, 2019 0:04:04 GMT
Which is why we needed a 2nd goal. Just on the way home from Craven Cottage and this was the absolute crux of it. Me, everyone around me, saying the same thing after our first goal. Fulham looked shaken, lost, all over the place. They didnt want it for that first 20-30 mins and we needed to kill the game, because they were never going to stay like that. We hit the post, had some decent chances to go two up but couldn't get it. Like Ricky said, when it comes to conceding, it is the same types of goals, over and over again. A free header from a cross that was too easy - and being QPR, of course it was Kamara who hadn't scored this season. Then easy goal from yet another defensive howler when we were well in the game. Bare in mind that at 1-1, we had Wells clean through and missed a very presentable chance. Lumley's error was particularly annoying because he panicked, went early and gifted Fulham a goal with a poor clearance...but after, with Eze on a storming run, Lumley held on for so long dithering that the chance went. Quick when he doesn't need to be, too slow when he doesn't have to be. On the walk to Putney station, people I was with were dissecting what had happened and it really feels like we miss a sense of basic pragmatism when it comes to dealing with shifts in the game. When Fulham scored the second, you could feel it coming. You felt the momentum shift. That's when you need 5 minutes of basic game management. Slow it down. Wrestle the power back. Take the sting out of the situation. But we just don't do it. I don't know if it's because players are focused so intently on a relatively new system or it's confidence or a lack of a steadying influence to make that call on the pitch or what. I'm not knocking the system, I like how we play. But bloody hell, when you have the inevitable spells of pressure and you feel it all getting on top, stop playing yourself into trouble. Maybe that's not the moment to play risky balls around your own box ponderously? We are so great at some of the hard stuff but make some of the easy stuff look so hard. You don't have to abandon the system to read the mood of the game and just reign it in for a few minutes. Overall, I think we played alright, particularly for the first 30. But that's the annoying bit, because we shot ourselves in the face, needlessly. I've seen us get absolutely battered at Craven Cottage before, but this was actually more disappointing, because Fulham weren't at their best and we created chances. They've got some great players, but quite a few weren't at it and were very, very gettable tonight. Off the pitch, Fulham continue to be near silent apart from when they score, armed with those weird paper clappers they seem so obsessed with. We had a good turn out with a boisterous, mostly supportive away end. Marred by a very, very weird brawl in the concourse at half time sparked by someone throwing some beer around. About 15-20 of our lot battering eachother - not fuelled by just beer I'd imagine.
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Post by harr on Nov 23, 2019 0:54:29 GMT
We won’t be winning many games though if we can’t get the defence sorted, conceding 20 goals in the last nine games is a bit of a joke. We might look very good in spells but one thing is for sure, we are always going to concede. Odds of 4-1 before the game to keep a clean sheet, hence to say I didn’t have a flutter on it.
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Post by rickyqpr on Nov 23, 2019 14:43:30 GMT
Pretty much spot on Bow. looked the same in the warmth of Sky! Couple of observations This was the first time since Luton that we started on the front foot and we really shook Fulham. The commentator remarked that QPR could have been out of sight by now. As I said above, the first goal was a repeat of our usual concede and came after Fulham started to press us back. We are not as good on the back foot by some way. You can feel the game turn once the opposition press us. The regular goal usually flows from when Manning is taken out of the game, by various ways, but usually missing the tackle. No-one closes down behind Manning and a free cross is granted. If the cross is on the floor, we are all over the place. If it is in the air, it usually splits the 2 centre halves, if it is at goal it usually goes in. So many problems from a simple start and our opponents know to press us and to wait for the error. Leinster did not have one of his better games and watched the ball sail over him. Hall was slow to get back. Teams know to keep the press going and wait for the second big error. They do their homework and know that either the keeper or the defender will eventually pass into trouble. Lumley obliged. Lumley and Kelly will make that error. I am not even sure how Smithies would have coped with this style of playing out from the back. He was a great stopper and kicker, but he was never asked to do what is demanded today. Smithies has not made it to number one at Cardiff even in this division. We have Dieng coming back in January and he has equipped himself well at Doncaster, but I have no idea if they play it out or just hoof it! It is hard to find what Warburton requires of a keeper. A great stopper has to be a ball player as well now. Only other point - the substitutions. The changes made a certain amount of senses at one all when they stripped off, but I was surprised to see Wells go off once they had scored their second. I like Chair but he is yet to score this season and so to go one down and take your top striker off when chasing seemed strange. Possibly connected to International travel, but still strange. Forest won't be easy, but I think we need that bit of luck to restore the confidence
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Post by terryb on Nov 23, 2019 14:56:54 GMT
It's taken a few hours but I now feel able to comment on last night, which I saw on Sky rather than being at the ground.
We started really well & were deservedly in front. There looked no danger of us concedeing (as in most matches until we do!) I can't remember if it was before their equaliser, but Kane should have controlled the ball with his left foot instead of trying to shoot first timw with it. That could have been 2-0 & it definitely should have been 2-1 when Wells was through on goal. Mind you, I can't remember us having a real chance after the Wells miss.
The Fulham first goal wss a shambles with three defenders being culpable. Their player went past Manning as if he didn't exist & far too easily. We then had the goalscorer take one step, which put him free of Leistner & Hall for a simple finish. Should Hall have left his man sooner to pick up the man inside him? Possibly, but I thought Leistner was the main culprit in losing his man. Perhaps a lack of communciacation between Lumley, Hall & Leistner also contributed?
Their is only one person responsible for the winner though! I thought this was worse from Lumley than when he set up Luton for their first goal. At least he had aimed to play the ball to a Rangers player on that occassion! This time it was a clearance that was intended to send the ball into the Fulham half & fell woefully short, a la Rob Green! I never thought that we would come back from that.
However, we gave a far better display than many of our visits to the Cottage.
Obviously the main reasons for the goals against us are due to bad defending, but I feel that a 'keeper of Smithies ability (rasther than Lumley or Kelly) would have seen the figure reduced by a fair amount. If only because the players had more confidence in the man behind them.
Still, I think I'm looking forward to watching us on Wednesday!
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Post by terryb on Nov 23, 2019 15:00:21 GMT
Pretty much spot on Bow. looked the same in the warmth of Sky! Couple of observations This was the first time since Luton that we started on the front foot and we really shook Fulham. The commentator remarked that QPR could have been out of sight by now. As I said above, the first goal was a repeat of our usual concede and came after Fulham started to press us back. We are not as good on the back foot by some way. You can feel the game turn once the opposition press us. The regular goal usually flows from when Manning is taken out of the game, by various ways, but usually missing the tackle. No-one closes down behind Manning and a free cross is granted. If the cross is on the floor, we are all over the place. If it is in the air, it usually splits the 2 centre halves, if it is at goal it usually goes in. So many problems from a simple start and our opponents know to press us and to wait for the error. Leinster did not have one of his better games and watched the ball sail over him. Hall was slow to get back. Teams know to keep the press going and wait for the second big error. They do their homework and know that either the keeper or the defender will eventually pass into trouble. Lumley obliged. Lumley and Kelly will make that error. I am not even sure how Smithies would have coped with this style of playing out from the back. He was a great stopper and kicker, but he was never asked to do what is demanded today. Smithies has not made it to number one at Cardiff even in this division. We have Dieng coming back in January and he has equipped himself well at Doncaster, but I have no idea if they play it out or just hoof it! It is hard to find what Warburton requires of a keeper. A great stopper has to be a ball player as well now. Only other point - the substitutions. The changes made a certain amount of senses at one all when they stripped off, but I was surprised to see Wells go off once they had scored their second. I like Chair but he is yet to score this season and so to go one down and take your top striker off when chasing seemed strange. Possibly connected to International travel, but still strange. Forest won't be easy, but I think we need that bit of luck to restore the confidence We can't blame playing out fromn the back for the Lumley error yesterday ricky. We had stopped doing that way earlier in the game & this one was intended as a clearance well into the Fulham half.
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Post by rickyqpr on Nov 23, 2019 15:36:19 GMT
Pretty much spot on Bow. looked the same in the warmth of Sky! Couple of observations This was the first time since Luton that we started on the front foot and we really shook Fulham. The commentator remarked that QPR could have been out of sight by now. As I said above, the first goal was a repeat of our usual concede and came after Fulham started to press us back. We are not as good on the back foot by some way. You can feel the game turn once the opposition press us. The regular goal usually flows from when Manning is taken out of the game, by various ways, but usually missing the tackle. No-one closes down behind Manning and a free cross is granted. If the cross is on the floor, we are all over the place. If it is in the air, it usually splits the 2 centre halves, if it is at goal it usually goes in. So many problems from a simple start and our opponents know to press us and to wait for the error. Leinster did not have one of his better games and watched the ball sail over him. Hall was slow to get back. Teams know to keep the press going and wait for the second big error. They do their homework and know that either the keeper or the defender will eventually pass into trouble. Lumley obliged. Lumley and Kelly will make that error. I am not even sure how Smithies would have coped with this style of playing out from the back. He was a great stopper and kicker, but he was never asked to do what is demanded today. Smithies has not made it to number one at Cardiff even in this division. We have Dieng coming back in January and he has equipped himself well at Doncaster, but I have no idea if they play it out or just hoof it! It is hard to find what Warburton requires of a keeper. A great stopper has to be a ball player as well now. Only other point - the substitutions. The changes made a certain amount of senses at one all when they stripped off, but I was surprised to see Wells go off once they had scored their second. I like Chair but he is yet to score this season and so to go one down and take your top striker off when chasing seemed strange. Possibly connected to International travel, but still strange. Forest won't be easy, but I think we need that bit of luck to restore the confidence We can't blame playing out fromn the back for the Lumley error yesterday ricky. We had stopped doing that way earlier in the game & this one was intended as a clearance well into the Fulham half. I switched off the game as the final whistle went last night, but watched the after match analysis this morning terry. They played the Lumley kick several times and they concluded it is impossible to work out what Lumley was thinking or trying to do. It could have been a mis-kick, or it could have been a poor pass or an attempted hoof. They concluded as I did, that as we are playing out from the back, the 2 centre halves split to receive the pass, when Lumley passes it straight to the opposition, they cannot get back into shape in time. Pass it to the defender, kick it long to the touchline or hoof it for distance, but pass it to the opposition and we are sunk. Warburton played down the error after the game, but there have been too many keeper errors this season and he must know that. For the first goal, he did mention that no-one attempted to cut out the cross. N.B. last night it was Amos who never closed down once Manning was taken out of the game, but it has been plenty of others.
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Post by rangersman on Nov 23, 2019 17:02:22 GMT
Lumley has to go, no way he should play again. In fact the entire defence tonight were crap. Really really poor performance, relegation performance.
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Post by rickyqpr on Nov 24, 2019 9:29:51 GMT
Lumley has to go, no way he should play again. In fact the entire defence tonight were crap. Really really poor performance, relegation performance. I understand your frustration, but some perspective perhaps? Of the 14 players that featured for us at Fulham, only Manning cost a fee (circa #150k) and 4 of the 14 were loanees. Fulham by comparison cost something like £20m (possibly much more depending on how much Mawson really cost). They have parachute payments, we are sweating on the FFP threshold. They have a Prem wage bill, we have trimmed, trimmed and trimmed again. So their squad cost circa 135 times that of ours. Their wage bill is probably three times that of ours. They were at home. We outplayed them for about 25 minutes. I badly wanted us to win, but it would have been an upset that could have put the skids under Parker if we had. As for Lumley, I watched Match of the Day last night and saw several examples of teams (and keepers) trying to play out from the back and getting into trouble. 'Arsenal are just not good enough to play out from the back' was one comment. Lumley is struggling, he made another serious mistake on Friday, but as I said above, the requirements placed on keepers today has changed big time. On our budget, can we find the replacement that is being demanded? Perhaps we have to work with the 4 keepers that we have to establish who is best at playing 'the new way'. Bad runs will always be relegation performance. Forest and Derby results may well add to that pressure, but the first 25 minutes still give me hope. Totally agree though that we cannot concede 2 goals a game for the rest of the season.
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Post by egranger on Nov 25, 2019 1:42:42 GMT
I expect Joe Lumley to play on Wednesday I hope that the home supporters get behind our keeper - unlike West Ham did on Saturday morning - how can that help a players confidence when they were sarcastically clapping him every time he caught it. Joe is still learning his trade and it won’t help his cause or the clubs if we don’t get behind him and the team on Wednesday.
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