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Post by Macmoish on Feb 5, 2015 8:27:07 GMT
Obviously Car Giant have a little bias here! London 24/Rob Brennan Cargiant say a new stadium on their land at Old Oak Common is not a viable option 08:00 05 February 2015 Rob Brennan An image of QPR An image of QPR's new stadium, which is planned as part of the Old Oak Common development QPR could build a new stadium in a different part of west London, according to Cargiant’s managing director Tony Mendes. QPR chairman Tony FernandesQPR chairman Tony Fernandes Mendes, a season ticket-holder at Loftus Road, says his company are currently working on relocating to a new site but are pushing ahead with their own plans to redevelop on the 47 acres that they own at Old Oak Common. The relocation has been forced following a decision by Eric Pickles, the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government, to approve a scheme by the Mayor of London to regenerate Old Oak Common with the creation of a brand new city with up to 24,000 homes and more than 55,000 jobs. Mendes told the Brent & Kilburn Times: “There are various options where QPR could build their stadium and keep the club in west London. “I think QPR want to build a stadium for free. They want to build residential units around the stadium to pay for it. “We would like to build our scheme for free and relocate Cargiant for free, but we can’t. There is no such a thing as a free dinner. “We have committed £140m towards our relocation already, plus 10s of millions on planning fees and professional fees that we have paid to bring our scheme forward. “The Greater London Authority asked us a year ago to regenerate this area and to relocate ourselves – we are doing both. We are consistently speaking to the GLA about our masterplan and getting their input every step of the way.” QPR chairman Tony Fernandes recently stated that “there is a compelling argument for how a new stadium will transform the area”. Fernandes added he was confident the club will find a way to work with the major landowners at Old Oak Common and remains optimistic that he will find a way to deliver a new stadium. But Mendes disagrees with Fernandes’ view on regeneration. He said: “A stadium can bring life to a regeneration area if it is on the outskirts of a city. You only have to look at what Manchester City have done. There was nothing there and the club have built up that area. “Here, we are 10 minutes away from Westfield, we have 170 acres of prime parkland and 1.2 kilometres of canal. There will be three or four stations of all different lines. “It will be a busy environment and a stadium would kill it to a certain extent. More than anything it is just not viable to do it. The cost of infastruture will only double. If it was [viable], we would build a stadium. Why wouldn’t you?” Mendes added: “QPR have been very vocal about how many residential units and jobs they will provide but there will be fewer homes and jobs if a stadium was built. “The whole Old Oak Common regeneration area will deliver around 55,000 jobs and 24,000 residential units. We want more homes, not less, because you have to provide a high percentage of affordable homes. The number has yet to be agreed but it is going to be high – the local authority and the GLA will want it to be high. “We estimate that, if a stadium was built, there would be 3,500 fewer residential units built. There will also be fewer jobs because the majority of staff don’t work in a stadium unless it is matchday. “Our scheme will have the wow factor. We will enhance the canal front, provide the schools, green spaces and other community needs required for a development this size. We want to make it an area where people will want to come and live.” Follow me @robbrennan82 www.london24.com/sport/football/clubs/qpr/cargiant_say_a_new_stadium_on_their_land_at_old_oak_common_is_not_a_viable_option_1_3944074
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Post by FloridaR on Feb 5, 2015 11:48:45 GMT
Sounds like someones talking from the heart. Might be worth finding another free stadium elsewhere Tony.
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Post by nadera78 on Feb 5, 2015 11:59:08 GMT
There is stacks of evidence from the US, where sports teams have been shameless in forcing city / state authorities to build them new stadia, that these facilities do nothing for regeneration. The benefits all go to the sports teams and little or nothing to the community. As to the development of this site, it's true that a stadium would take up land that could be used for another couple of thousand residential units. It comes down to whether or not you think a 40K stadium, offering occasional work for students, etc is worth the loss of those units.
What's interesting is that QPR needs the entire 200 acres, not just the 47 Car Giant plot, so it can build enough units that will not only pay for the stadium but also pay off the obscene £200million debt that has been accumulated over the last few years. If it was just about a new stadium we'd have gone for the M&S warehouses behind White City where we could have built a 30K stadium and a few hundred units. That, along with flats on Loftus Rd, would have covered the cost of the new stadium but not the debts.
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Post by sharky on Feb 5, 2015 12:43:46 GMT
Sounds like someones talking from the heart. Might be worth finding another free stadium elsewhere Tony. Sounds like someone talking bs to try and up the price of their land to me. Never wanted to move in the first place now saying they always wanted to move. What a load of you know what!
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Post by sharky on Feb 5, 2015 12:46:45 GMT
There is stacks of evidence from the US, where sports teams have been shameless in forcing city / state authorities to build them new stadia, that these facilities do nothing for regeneration. The benefits all go to the sports teams and little or nothing to the community. As to the development of this site, it's true that a stadium would take up land that could be used for another couple of thousand residential units. It comes down to whether or not you think a 40K stadium, offering occasional work for students, etc is worth the loss of those units. What's interesting is that QPR needs the entire 200 acres, not just the 47 Car Giant plot, so it can build enough units that will not only pay for the stadium but also pay off the obscene £200million debt that has been accumulated over the last few years. If it was just about a new stadium we'd have gone for the M&S warehouses behind White City where we could have built a 30K stadium and a few hundred units. That, along with flats on Loftus Rd, would have covered the cost of the new stadium but not the debts. So what do you suggest, build a stadium tens, no hundreds of miles from W12?
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Post by Markqpr on Feb 5, 2015 12:55:19 GMT
There is stacks of evidence from the US, where sports teams have been shameless in forcing city / state authorities to build them new stadia, that these facilities do nothing for regeneration. The benefits all go to the sports teams and little or nothing to the community. As to the development of this site, it's true that a stadium would take up land that could be used for another couple of thousand residential units. It comes down to whether or not you think a 40K stadium, offering occasional work for students, etc is worth the loss of those units. What's interesting is that QPR needs the entire 200 acres, not just the 47 Car Giant plot, so it can build enough units that will not only pay for the stadium but also pay off the obscene £200million debt that has been accumulated over the last few years. If it was just about a new stadium we'd have gone for the M&S warehouses behind White City where we could have built a 30K stadium and a few hundred units. That, along with flats on Loftus Rd, would have covered the cost of the new stadium but not the debts. So what do you suggest, build a stadium tens, no hundreds of miles from W12? No, Nadera suggests the M&S wharehouses, 100's of metres away from Loftus Road, behind White City tube station. It's in the actual post that you quoted. As a football club we only need a new stadium, not 24,000 flats as well. It's only the board that are saying we need both otherwise we have to move far away. There are alternatives in the local surround for just a stadium of adequate size for our club, if that was the board's actual intention.
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Post by FloridaR on Feb 5, 2015 13:35:16 GMT
A stadium in my town here in the US was build though the City Council creating a quango board, who then got a $100 million black market bond to build the stadium with the City(taxpayer) being the ones as default owners. The Quango board (company) was supposed to make bond payments but has only ever managed to make sporadic interest payments on the Bond. purpose baseball stadium, attendances low, year after year of losses, set in good part of developing town. Surprise the quango just announced in jan that they agreed to sell off outlying stadium parcels to developers to make waterfront flats...The intention is that the flats profits will pay the interest on the bond or possibly pay off a little of the bond. Ultimately taxes are footing the bill.
I think they'd be better off & cheaper to do is knock down the ellersie for a season and build a double tier raising capacity but I doubt Tony would want to put his money into building.
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Post by Macmoish on Feb 8, 2015 9:35:22 GMT
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Post by FloridaR on Feb 8, 2015 14:14:41 GMT
Slick. Must of cost $3mill to produce the marketing. Looking forward to our new 40k stadium. Thanks Tony.
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Post by Macmoish on Feb 12, 2015 7:26:48 GMT
- www.itv.com/news/update/2015-02-11/huge-blow-for-qpr-as-deputy-mayor-of-london-backs-car-giant-regeneration-plans/Huge blow for QPR as Deputy Mayor backs Car Giant regeneration plans
QPR finally secured three points away from home on Tuesday evening, but their plans to build a new stadium at Old Oak Common have today suffered a fatal blow.Last year, the Premier League club announced plans to create 55,000 new jobs with 24,000 homes and a new 40,000 capacity stadium on land owned by Car Giant, the world's largest car dealership. Car Giant weren't consulted by the club before last year's announcement and made it clear they were planning to regenerate the land themselves. They have been working closely with the Greater London Authority for several months, and London's Deputy Mayor for Planning, Sir Edward Lister, today confirmed:
Old Oak Common represents an unprecedented chance to create a truly new piece of London. Car Giant is set to play an enormously important role in the regeneration of the area and we are already working with their development partner London & Regional as they help to deliver the Mayor’s vision for much needed new homes and jobs. Following the Government’s approval of our plans to set up a new Development Corporation, there is now real momentum as we look to maximise this once-in-a-generation opportunity.– London Deputy Mayor for Planning, Sir Edward Lister www.itv.com/news/update/2015-02-11/huge-blow-for-qpr-as-deputy-mayor-of-london-backs-car-giant-regeneration-plans/
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Post by Macmoish on Feb 12, 2015 7:27:20 GMT
Co Star - Press Release/Statement
Cargiant slams door on QPR stadium moveBy Paul Norman - Wednesday, February 11, 2015 15:00 Cargiant and London & Regional have announced the project team for their major regeneration plans in Old Oak Common in a move likely to effectively end Queens Park Rangers' aspirations to build a new Premier League Stadium on the site. London & Regional Properties replaced Chelsfield as sole development partner to landowner Cargiant in December of last year. Cargiant, the largest private landowner within the Old Oak Common regeneration area in west London, has now appointed its masterplan team for Old Oak Park. The team, fully disclosed below, includes Arup, DP9 and PLP Architecture. Old Oak Park is home to the world’s largest car dealership, Cargiant. The 47 acre site is a centrepiece for the development of Old Oak Common. Cargiant has been proposing a £5bn new town on the site, which at present houses up to 7,000 used cars. The initial plans would include around 9,500 homes and a new high street, two schools – a primary and secondary school - a new dock and a “cultural hub”. Premier League football club QPR has however earmarked the site for a separate scheme comprising a 40,000-seat stadium and 24,000 new homes. For QPR's aspirations to come forward however Cargiant would need to agree to house the hoops on its land or else the site would need to be CPO'd. It is understood that Cargiant's opposition to a stadium on the site remains implacable and the Cargiant consortium is confident that there are no legal grounds for a CPO to make way for QPR's plans given that there is no case for it as a "necessity" as they are proposing a major regeneration scheme. The Greater London Authority's endorsement of the Cargiant consortium also suggests there is little appetite from the mayor for a CPO battle over the site. Tony Mendes, managing director of Cargiant, said: “I’m delighted we have appointed our full masterplanning team and to have such expert partners working with us. As a major landowner and one of the most successful local businesses in the area, we are an important part of the community and best placed to understand what is right for the site. “We are committed to delivering a scheme of exceptional quality, which brings real benefit for local people. We want this to be a part of London we would all be proud to live in and visit. “There is already great momentum behind the project and we look forward to talking to local communities in the coming months so that those who already live and work around Old Oak Common directly help to shape its future.” Cargiant said it supports the Mayor of London’s vision for Old Oak Common and is working collaboratively with the GLA and the emerging Park Royal and Old Oak Mayoral Development Corporation (OPDC), as well as the London Borough of Hammersmith & Fulham, to develop a world class new neighbourhood. The next phase of consultation with the local community will begin in the Spring. Sir Edward Lister, Deputy Mayor for Planning, said: “Old Oak Common represents an unprecedented chance to create a truly new piece of London. Cargiant is set to play an enormously important role in the regeneration of the area and we are already working with their development partner London & Regional as they help to deliver the Mayor’s vision for much needed new homes and jobs. Following the Government’s approval of our plans to set up a new Development Corporation, there is now real momentum as we look to maximise this once-in-a-generation opportunity.” Geoff Springer, Development Director at London & Regional said: “The Cargiant site will be the first to be delivered within the OPDC area, setting the standard for the wider regeneration of the area. It is vital therefore that we create the right linkages across the area, and make best use of the huge investment going into transport infrastructure at Old Oak Common. “Most importantly however, we need to create a place that people and families right across London would chose to live in, with good schools, parks and high quality new homes. We are committed to delivering that vision.” Lee Polisano, Founding Partner of PLP Architecture who will lead the Masterplan team, said: “We are very pleased to be involved in shaping this significant new piece of London. The site represents an opportunity to create much needed new homes, jobs and fantastic public spaces benefiting from new rail connections and access to the Grand Union Canal. Bringing experience, expertise and a creative approach gained from leading and delivering several high profile urban planning and architecture projects we are looking forward to create Old Oak Park in close collaboration with the local boroughs and the OPDC.” The full Cargiant Old Oak Park team is as follows: London & Regional Properties - Development Managers DP9 - Planning Consultants PLP Architecture - Masterplanners Arup - Infrastructure and engineering iCube - Transport West 8 - Landscape Architects Aecom - Energy and sustainability Quod - Socio-Economics Tavernor Consulting - Heritage Waterman Group - Environmental Impact London Communications Agency - Consultation and Communications pnorman@costar.co.uk www.costar.co.uk/en/assets/news/2015/February/Cargiant/
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Post by Macmoish on Feb 12, 2015 7:48:42 GMT
The Car Giant "Partner" - London and Regional Properties lrp.co.uk/
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Post by sharky on Feb 12, 2015 11:00:23 GMT
What a nasty bunch Cargiant are. They let the QPR led bid get all the things lined up to get Old Oak developed and then jump in to hijack the development.
That's business I suppose but its still a nasty thing to do.
Bastards IMO
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Post by Macmoish on Feb 12, 2015 11:09:53 GMT
Possibly. Although it'sbeen suggested that if the QPR Owners' bid had been done better vis-a-vis Car Giant, could have been avoided.
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Post by sharky on Feb 12, 2015 11:27:07 GMT
Possibly. Although it'sbeen suggested that if the QPR Owners' bid had been done better vis-a-vis Car Giant, could have been avoided. Don't think so Mac. Think they were very happy not to be involved with the QPR Owners' bid planning to hijack it later once the QPR Owners bid had gained Old Oak fast track redevelopment. If its proven that the QPR Owners bid is a no go I suppose we'll soon find out if they're only in it for the development money and sell QPR at the first opportunity.
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Post by RoryTheRanger on Feb 12, 2015 12:24:07 GMT
That article from ITV tells us literally nothing new, of course CarGiant are going to play a part, they own 20% of the land. Plenty of room still there for a stadium. What a nothing article and waste of time reading it.
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qprha4
Gerry Francis
Lower Loft, to R-Block, to S Block, to X Block… Loyal Supporter
Posts: 53
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Post by qprha4 on Feb 12, 2015 12:38:09 GMT
The facts are Fernandes & co have confused the hell out of every QPR fan with pointless PR and with it, made the club look unprofessional whilst throwing a lot of money down the drain.
You cannot tell thousands of QPR fans there will be a stadium built in 3/4yrs on land owned by someone else UNLESS you've agreed a deal to buy the land AND have exchanged on it.
So unprofessional
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Post by Marc on Feb 12, 2015 13:27:57 GMT
The facts are Fernandes & co have confused the hell out of every QPR fan with pointless PR and with it, made the club look unprofessional whilst throwing a lot of money down the drain. You cannot tell thousands of QPR fans there will be a stadium built in 3/4yrs on land owned by someone else UNLESS you've agreed a deal to buy the land AND have exchanged on it. So unprofessional You sure about those "facts"? Not sure anyone said there "will" be a stadium built. They may have told of their plans to build a stadium at Old Oak but I very much doubt that they were announced as definite.
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Post by FloridaR on Feb 12, 2015 13:37:35 GMT
The Car Giant "Partner" - London and Regional Properties lrp.co.uk/Heavy weights, no chance for the Rangers in with these guys in the game.
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qprha4
Gerry Francis
Lower Loft, to R-Block, to S Block, to X Block… Loyal Supporter
Posts: 53
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Post by qprha4 on Feb 12, 2015 13:41:24 GMT
The facts are Fernandes & co have confused the hell out of every QPR fan with pointless PR and with it, made the club look unprofessional whilst throwing a lot of money down the drain. You cannot tell thousands of QPR fans there will be a stadium built in 3/4yrs on land owned by someone else UNLESS you've agreed a deal to buy the land AND have exchanged on it. So unprofessional You sure about those "facts"? Not sure anyone said there "will" be a stadium built. They may have told of their plans to build a stadium at Old Oak but I very much doubt that they were announced as definite. www.24dash.com/news/housing/2014-08-01-QPR-will-be-in-new-stadium-by-2018-chairman
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Post by FloridaR on Feb 12, 2015 13:57:42 GMT
I think the club should plan b & look toward Perivale golf course / Greenford area as lots of land is available.
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Post by Marc on Feb 12, 2015 13:59:31 GMT
In that context, the word "will" can be read as "the plan is to".
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qprha4
Gerry Francis
Lower Loft, to R-Block, to S Block, to X Block… Loyal Supporter
Posts: 53
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Post by qprha4 on Feb 12, 2015 14:54:58 GMT
In that context, the word "will" can be read as "the plan is to". In whichever context you like, t ell me about a stadium, training ground, dream manager and whatever else once the contracts have been signed and everything is in place...
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Post by sharky on Feb 12, 2015 15:01:51 GMT
In that context, the word "will" can be read as "the plan is to". In whichever context you like, t ell me about a stadium, training ground, dream manager and whatever else once the contracts have been signed and everything is in place... In a realistic modern world this can't happen I'm afraid ha4. To get something this big over the line there needs to be a huge amount of marketing and sales. Imagine what people living near where a large football stadium was going to go would say if they hadn't had the ability to put their feeling forward. Not realistic unfortunately.
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Post by Marc on Feb 12, 2015 15:20:40 GMT
In whichever context you like, t ell me about a stadium, training ground, dream manager and whatever else once the contracts have been signed and everything is in place... In a realistic modern world this can't happen I'm afraid ha4. To get something this big over the line there needs to be a huge amount of marketing and sales. Imagine what people living near where a large football stadium was going to go would say if they hadn't had the ability to put their feeling forward. Not realistic unfortunately. ^^^ WHS
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qprha4
Gerry Francis
Lower Loft, to R-Block, to S Block, to X Block… Loyal Supporter
Posts: 53
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Post by qprha4 on Feb 12, 2015 16:53:21 GMT
We'll have to agree to disagree on this one lads as we'll be going back and forward for ages… but one thing which is clearly realistic is the caliber of the team behind the car giant plans and after reading the statements again I don't think they're too bothered by QPR's plans...
Those in the know will know WHO and how BIG the likes of London & Regional, DP9, PLP & Arup are… google them!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2015 23:23:05 GMT
Both playing the same game ... QPR need housing to fund new stadium and Cargiant need homes to fund move! ...
Cargiant own land and looking after there own interests just as we all would. Not a little arrogant publicising new stadium that hasn't planning or on land you have no ownership .. What is that all about?
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Post by blatantfowl on Feb 13, 2015 1:29:45 GMT
I might submit my own plans for the regeneration of old oak. After all, my relationship with cargiant and my rights to build on land I don't own is just as strong as TFs.
Anyone wanna come in with me?
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Post by Macmoish on Feb 13, 2015 7:17:24 GMT
Oped by Hammersmith MP Andy Slaughter n Boris Johnson’s mini-Manhattan in Old Oak Common: Why we must speak up for local housing needs Andy Slaughter is MP for Hammersmith. by Andy Slaughter 12 February 2015 London's population is at an all-time high. By 2020, we will have over 9m people living in our city; 10m by 2030. So it is essential that we plan for the growing needs of the capital. London needs a transport system fit for the 21st century. We need a thriving jobs market built on secure, well-paid and high-skill employment. And we also need the right housing strategy to deliver homes for inhabitants of all ages and incomes. If we are to provide the jobs and homes that London needs, and in a way that protects our precious open spaces, we must first look to the major brownfield sites that remain undeveloped. The biggest of these is at Old Oak, which is in my constituency. It’s the site of the HS2 interchange and has been proposed by mayor Boris Johnson as his second Mayoral Development Corporation (MDC) after the Olympic Park. I have secured a debate in Parliament today on his and the government’s plans for Old Oak and neighbouring Park Royal, Europe’s biggest industrial estate, because I do not believe the current proposals are in the best interests of local communities. There is cross-party agreement that this site, which has picked up the moniker “the Canary Wharf of the West,” and which Boris calls a “mini-Manhattan,” is ripe for major regeneration. Not only is it the location of HS2, but also Crossrail and new Overground stations. Moreover, there is, in principle, support for an MDC. But – and it is a major but – the mini-Manhattan proposal risks wasting an opportunity to provide affordable homes. It also poses a threat to one of London’s major wild open spaces, Wormwood Scrubs. The MDC now promises 25,500 homes. But on current plans, none of those are guaranteed to be both designed and affordable for local residents. The involvement of Boris in previous major projects in my constituency, at Earl’s Court and White City, suggest that the template will be high-density tall buildings, consisting of the small top-end flats that risk of being snapped up by the foreign investor market – so-called “safe deposit flats”. It may also spell disaster for the small and medium-sized firms that provide local employment. The safeguard is obvious: allow local firms, residents, environmental groups and councils to have a controlling say on the MDC board. But as it stands, their role is limited, and the majority of seats are given to the mayor, his officers and developer interests. This project is large enough to contribute to solving London’s housing crisis, but it is also a test of how serious City Hall and Whitehall are about building homes for Londoners. Much of the Old Oak land is publicly owned and Car Giant, which owns 40 acres, has said that it is willing to discuss a mixed economy of housing for its site. If Boris and the Coalition press on with their land grab and plans to build against the interest of Londoners in some of the city’s poorest communities, then we need to replace them with administrations that have the vision to build a sustainable London. www.cityam.com/209241/boris-mini-manhattan-why-we-must-speak-local-housing-needs
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qprha4
Gerry Francis
Lower Loft, to R-Block, to S Block, to X Block… Loyal Supporter
Posts: 53
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Post by qprha4 on Feb 13, 2015 14:17:30 GMT
I might submit my own plans for the regeneration of old oak. After all, my relationship with cargiant and my rights to build on land I don't own is just as strong as TFs. Anyone wanna come in with me? I'm in... We'll create a new website/twitter account called say "NewishButSlightlyOldOakCommonPark.co.uk" and can start our PR campaign… just need to think of a catchy hashtag... How about
#WeveGotNoMoneyBUTWouldLovetoKeepRangersNearLoftusRdAndMakeAFortuneBuildingHousesOnLandWeDontOwn (Its got a nice ring to it) Sorry couldn't resist
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