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Post by sharky on Jul 23, 2014 11:57:35 GMT
From betfair.com betting.betfair.com/football/premier-league/top-promoted-team-betting-qpr-are-the-ones-to-back-230714-39.html?Top Promoted Team Betting: QPR are the ones to back Harry Redknapp's experience will be an asset for QPR in 2014/15 Play-off winners tend to adapt to the Premier League better than Championship table-toppers, and QPR are equipped to maintain that trend... There is little correlation between emphatic Championship success and comfortable Premier League survival, as proven by six seasons passing since the promoted trio last finished in the same order upon arrival in the top tier. If anything, the statistics say that Championship winners have the trickiest time hanging on among the elite for more than a year. The last three champions all ranked the lowest of the newcomers, with two suffering relegation (Cardiff and Reading) and the others clinging on in 17th (QPR). Quite why this phenomenon exists is difficult to define. It might in part be down to the expectation on them to reach the haven of 40 points weighing heaviest, or that they find the transition from winning every week to frequently losing the toughest to adjust to. Alternatively, it could be that the table-toppers are happiest with their lot and feel less inclined to overhaul their squad, resulting in them having less Premier League experience in both their squad and dugout than their fellow novices. Premier League knowhow has definitely been decisive recently. Last term, runners-up Hull had Steve Bruce and play-off victors Crystal Palace had Ian Holloway then an even more established Tony Pulis, whereas title claimants Cardiff veered from Malky Mackay to Ole Gunnar Solskjaer. The rookie managers were the relegated ones. There was a similar scenario in 2012/13, when Sam Allardyce trumped Brian McDermott and Nigel Adkins for miles on the clock and ultimately points on the board too, so QPR's Harry Redknapp card wields more gravitas than Leicester's Nigel Pearson or Burnley's Sean Dyche can muster. The not-a-wheeler-dealer has hastily recruited Premier League savvy in England internationals Rio Ferdinand and Steven Caulker, whereas the most expensive recruits for the Foxes (Leonardo Ulloa) and Clarets (Lukas Jutkiewicz and Michael Kightly) are far less proven. Factor in the number of Premier League veterans already in the Hoops squad (Robert Green, Richard Dunne, Joey Barton, Bobby Zamora, etc), their underachievement in 2013/14 (similar to West Ham, who improved after confirming promotion at Wembley in 2011/12) and the bigger budget at their disposal, and they appear by far the best bet to be top-performing newbies at 2.84. It would be a fourth successive triumph for the play-off winners, though if you disagree, you can back Leicester at 2.1 or Burnley at 5.4.
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Post by nomar on Jul 23, 2014 13:44:41 GMT
There does seem to be a trend where the championship playoff winners tend to fare the best and the Championship winners fare the worst once promoted.
Funnily enough, I expect that trend to continue this season. I think Leicester will be pretty much doomed by Xmas. Burnley strike me as potentially being another Palace but could also be another Blackpool. I think and Hope we'll be more like Hull last season.
My guess is that Pearson will be gone by Xmas. Dyche might be too if they slump early.
Having Harry as manager is the trump card for me as far as our Premier League survival is concerned. Harry knows this league like the back of his hand so he knows how to put a team together to get 40 points. Neither Pearson or Dyche have that experience and that may be the difference in the end.
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Post by timewaster on Jul 23, 2014 14:04:01 GMT
I think Leicester will stay up and QPR and Burnley may fall again. I hope that I am wrong though and the bookies are right.
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Post by nomar on Jul 23, 2014 21:18:15 GMT
I think Leicester will stay up and QPR and Burnley may fall again. I hope that I am wrong though and the bookies are right. We're a different team than the shower of 'you know what' that disgraced the Premier League last time. We were horrendous that season and yet we still got 25 points so you're looking at a team that needs to get 4 more wins and 3 draws more than that sad sack effort of a team managed. Considering how much better we should be now that we have players who are prepared to graft I really think this side is capable of being 14/15 points better than the class of 2012/13. I'm confident Harry will put together a team that can get 40 points.
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Post by timewaster on Jul 24, 2014 3:42:18 GMT
I think Leicester will stay up and QPR and Burnley may fall again. I hope that I am wrong though and the bookies are right. We're a different team than the shower of 'you know what' that disgraced the Premier League last time. We were horrendous that season and yet we still got 25 points so you're looking at a team that needs to get 4 more wins and 3 draws more than that sad sack effort of a team managed. Considering how much better we should be now that we have players who are prepared to graft I really think this side is capable of being 14/15 points better than the class of 2012/13. I'm confident Harry will put together a team that can get 40 points. I hope so mate
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Post by nomar on Jul 24, 2014 5:29:23 GMT
We're a different team than the shower of 'you know what' that disgraced the Premier League last time. We were horrendous that season and yet we still got 25 points so you're looking at a team that needs to get 4 more wins and 3 draws more than that sad sack effort of a team managed. Considering how much better we should be now that we have players who are prepared to graft I really think this side is capable of being 14/15 points better than the class of 2012/13. I'm confident Harry will put together a team that can get 40 points. I hope so mate Last season 34 points would have kept you up so we may not even need to get to 40 to be safe. Seven teams failed to reach the 40 point mark last term so you never can tell what the magical number is going to end up being. Also, the key to our relegation in 2012/13 was that we never got a win until the 17th game of the season. That's virtually half a season gone before picking up our first 3 points. No team is going to recover from a start that bad. This team is nowhere near as dysfunctional as that outfit so you have to genuinely believe that it won't be 17 games this season before we actually win a game. Our top scorer that season was Remy with 6 goals, we had nothing up front until he came in January. We have a goalscorer from day one now. When Harry first came here he started by tightening us up defensively. In our first 13 games under Hughes and assistant we conceded 3 goals 5 times. In Redknapp's 24 games at the helm we conceded 3+ just 5 times more. What's the first thing Redknapp has done on our return to the Prem? Bought in top class defenders. Teams that are solid defensively don't get relegated. It will be a slog for sure, but considering we got 25 points from a team of mercenaries that didn't care, I'm pretty confident Harry can build a team that can get 4 wins and 3 draws more than that sad sack outfit.
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peterg
Ian Holloway
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Post by peterg on Jul 25, 2014 21:23:37 GMT
The key to staying up is winning games that may seem obvious but my concern is that we have improved the team at the back but up front we have a team that didn't manage to score enough goals to get us promoted. With Remy going we are left with Austin who isn't proven although I think he will do ok but we need more firepower. I am sure it is going to come but until it does I see us as relegation candidates along with Burnley Leicester and villa
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Post by timewaster on Jul 25, 2014 21:59:54 GMT
We certainly need another striker to come in. Watford fans rate Deeney very highly and maybe he could score the goals for us. Other clubs seem to be interested in him as well though, especially Leicester.
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Post by kerrins on Jul 26, 2014 9:29:20 GMT
I see us finishing higher up than Burnley who are stone wall bankers for bottom place....other than that at the moment I cant really say.
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Post by gramps on Jul 26, 2014 10:13:23 GMT
I have never made a secret of the fact that I felt we were not yet ready for promotion and I still feel uncomfortable about the coming season. A strengthening of the defence does, however, make me feel somewhat more optimistic that we can avoid the drop; all I ask is that we are safe by about February because I am not sure my heart can take any more last minute dramas. I was not sure about the signing of Ferdinand but hopefully his ball skills will compensate for his lack of speed and at the end of the day he only has a one year contract. Still feel we need another goal-scorer; not necessarily an out and out striker but rather a powerful attacking midfielder.
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Post by timewaster on Jul 26, 2014 15:21:26 GMT
I have never made a secret of the fact that I felt we were not yet ready for promotion and I still feel uncomfortable about the coming season. A strengthening of the defence does, however, make me feel somewhat more optimistic that we can avoid the drop; all I ask is that we are safe by about February because I am not sure my heart can take any more last minute dramas. I was not sure about the signing of Ferdinand but hopefully his ball skills will compensate for his lack of speed and at the end of the day he only has a one year contract. Still feel we need another goal-scorer; not necessarily an out and out striker but rather a powerful attacking midfielder. Hi gramps and agree with you about needing another striker
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Post by sharky on Aug 5, 2014 13:46:59 GMT
From goal.com www.goal.com/en/news/2994/betting/2014/08/05/5004251/-?Betting Special: Why the Foxes are a solid selection to be the pick of the Premier League new boys By William Duncan0 Aug 5, 2014 10:00:00 With the Premier League kick-off just around the corner, Willie Duncan takes a look at the top flight's newest inductees and he is backing the Foxes to outperform QPR and Burnley With the Premier League kick-off now less than two weeks away, supporters up and down the country will be wondering what season 2014-15 holds for their club. Of course, for fans of Leicester City, Burnley and QPR, the season ahead represents a new challenge - a return to top flight football. How, though, will the Premier League's latest inductees fare on their debut season in the top tier? For Leicester City, the prevalent mood is one of optimism following a triumphant season in the Championship last term that saw Nigel Pearson's men rack up a hugely impressive 102 points on their way back up to the Premier League. The Foxes have kept the bulk of that title-winning squad and Nigel Pearson's side are capable of, at least, preserving their top-flight status in the season ahead. With that in mind, Leicester look to be a solid selection at a generous even money (2.0) with bet365 to be the best of the newly-promoted teams in this season's Premier League. Burnley, of course, grabbed the second automatic promotion place behind the Foxes last term and Sean Dyche's side will be hoping for a solid campaign having brought in a raft of established professionals with Premier League experience such as Steven Reid, Matt Taylor and Marvin Sordell. Burnley, though, may lack the quality required to adapt to life in the Premier League and the task facing the Clarets is reflected in the chunky 4/1 (5.0) quote from bet365 for Sean Dyche's side merely to outperform Leicester and QPR this season. For QPR and Harry Redknapp, this season represents a chance at redemption. Rangers were relegated in April 2013 but have clawed their way back into the Premier League by virtue of a dramatic Championship play-off final win against Derby County at the end of last season. Redknapp will be hoping that the prolific Charlie Austin can grab the goals to keep the west Londoners afloat while Rangers have added Steven Caulker and Rio Ferdinand to their squad as they seek to strengthen their defensive unit. There may well be interest in Redknapp's charges at 11/8 (2.38) with bet365 to finish above both Leicester and Burnley but Rangers could be considered fortunate to have gained promotion and they may well find it difficult to adjust to the step up in class. Leicester City, by contrast, smashed several club records in gaining promotion last season and, although they have been absent from the top flight for 10 years, there is no doubt that Nigel Pearson's side look best equipped of the Premier League "new boys" and there is value in backing the Foxes to be the top newly-promoted club at even money (2.0) with bet365.
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Post by corndog on Aug 5, 2014 14:43:38 GMT
The key to staying up is winning games that may seem obvious but my concern is that we have improved the team at the back but up front we have a team that didn't manage to score enough goals to get us promoted. With Remy going we are left with Austin who isn't proven although I think he will do ok but we need more firepower. I am sure it is going to come but until it does I see us as relegation candidates along with Burnley Leicester and villa Harry is holding a meeting with Adel and Remy to see where they stand. If they are on the right page with the current team, we will be more than fine. If they leave we at least need one more striker and probably an attacking midfielder. It also sounds like Remy would end up at Newcastle with a huge payout coming back to QPR.
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ingham
Dave Sexton
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Post by ingham on Aug 9, 2014 18:58:09 GMT
Interesting spread of views. I'd be curious to know - if some supercomputer could provide the figures - how often we, or anyone else, was right about this sort of thing.
I never have any idea, and I suppose predictability would kill the game anyway. It is hard to tell which qualities will emerge as significant. One or two players can have a disproportionate effect (and their loss). Sometimes, a team's tactics are surprisingly effective.
Remember the sudden eruption of 'route one' at Watford and then Wimbledon, with performances that were scarcely football at the latter sometimes. Or the eventual disappearance of ultra-defensive football (having become more or less mandatory even though no general style of play can be deemed to be successful where only one Club actually wins.
Every Club seems to change so much season to season now, that the variables and imponderables must play havoc with tactical systems, formations and team selection.
And the margins by which teams win are so slight. Some games are won or lost convincingly, but so many are close, and decided by situations that nobody is really in control of, that it's no wonder that we can imagine almost any league position between 5th (did someone say 5th?) and bottom.
I like the bit about strengthening the defence. That seems so basic (if you're not all that, you still have a chance if you can defend) that it has been a mystery for years at QPR.
And that's another problem. Why DO managers persist with certain weaknesses which are clearly going to work against a team week in week out? Our defence has puzzled supporters for a long time now.
I remember the notorious offside trap. Not nice, and I assumed it was bequeathed to us by George Graham, on his way to remarkable title wins at Arsenal. But it did make us hard to beat by the weaker teams, and some of the more skilful but less clinical ones.
Did we deal with the obvious better at one time? Replace Clive Allen with Bannister. Maybe we just got lucky from time to time, and then it slipped away.
So many variables. And it is even more complicated when you try to picture a given regime extending its shelf-life for more than two or three seasons. At smaller Clubs, that is when it gets really tough.
Fascinated to see where we are in 5 years' time.
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peterg
Ian Holloway
Posts: 466
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Post by peterg on Aug 9, 2014 19:08:33 GMT
Was it another rangers boy john beck who introduced the route one revolution at Cambridge?
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Post by Bushman on Aug 9, 2014 19:30:11 GMT
Interesting spread of views. I'd be curious to know - if some supercomputer could provide the figures - how often we, or anyone else, was right about this sort of thing. I never have any idea, and I suppose predictability would kill the game anyway. It is hard to tell which qualities will emerge as significant. One or two players can have a disproportionate effect (and their loss). Sometimes, a team's tactics are surprisingly effective. Remember the sudden eruption of 'route one' at Watford and then Wimbledon, with performances that were scarcely football at the latter sometimes. Or the eventual disappearance of ultra-defensive football (having become more or less mandatory even though no general style of play can be deemed to be successful where only one Club actually wins. Every Club seems to change so much season to season now, that the variables and imponderables must play havoc with tactical systems, formations and team selection. And the margins by which teams win are so slight. Some games are won or lost convincingly, but so many are close, and decided by situations that nobody is really in control of, that it's no wonder that we can imagine almost any league position between 5th (did someone say 5th?) and bottom. I like the bit about strengthening the defence. That seems so basic (if you're not all that, you still have a chance if you can defend) that it has been a mystery for years at QPR. And that's another problem. Why DO managers persist with certain weaknesses which are clearly going to work against a team week in week out? Our defence has puzzled supporters for a long time now. I remember the notorious offside trap. Not nice, and I assumed it was bequeathed to us by George Graham, on his way to remarkable title wins at Arsenal. But it did make us hard to beat by the weaker teams, and some of the more skilful but less clinical ones. Did we deal with the obvious better at one time? Replace Clive Allen with Bannister. Maybe we just got lucky from time to time, and then it slipped away. So many variables. And it is even more complicated when you try to picture a given regime extending its shelf-life for more than two or three seasons. At smaller Clubs, that is when it gets really tough. Fascinated to see where we are in 5 years' time. Loftus Rd.
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Post by Bushman on Aug 10, 2014 10:22:29 GMT
Loftus Rd. "I had a Dream"........ In 5 years we will be The Old Oak Steelers and another 5 years later Warren Farm Rangers in the Conference League South reinvented from the liquidated Old Oak Steelers - but we will have good green and white shirts, a nice badge and no money worries. Then I woke up again and found it's only 6 days to go and we can get back to the real world.
Are you on the strong stuff already.
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Post by sharky on Aug 10, 2014 12:38:44 GMT
From ladbrokes news.ladbrokes.com/en-gb/football/premier-league/qpr-great-premier-league-boys_206904.html QPR great value to be best of the Premier League new boys The Rs are a generous 6/4 to finish above Leicester and Burnley this season Barclays Premier League 2014/15 Top promoted club Leicester City11/10 QPR6/4 Burnley7/2 Life at QPR has been far from boring in recent seasons, with the Rs going through two promotions, one relegation and one narrow escape in four years. Despite being comfortable favourites to win the Championship, they squeaked back into the Premier League last season by virtue of a last-gasp play-off victory over Derby. That underwhelming campaign is no doubt a major part of the reason that the Rs are priced at 6/4 to be top promoted club this year, behind market leaders Leicester City, who are 11/10. However, QPR have both recent history and an impressive squad on their side in this battle, and punters should be grabbing those generous odds while they last. In the past three seasons, Championship winners have actually fared the worst in their first season in the top-flight, with Cardiff and Reading relegated and QPR themselves finishing 17th. Last season play-off victors Crystal Palace strolled to 11th under the tutelage of Tony Pulis, while in 2012-13 West Ham were also the best promoted club having gone up via the more treacherous play-off route. As with both the Irons and the Eagles, QPR boast a manager with impressive top-flight experience in the shape of Harry Redknapp, and their squad is laden with Premier League nous. They have also added to the likes of Joey Barton and Robert Green this summer by bringing in Rio Ferdinand, whose vast experience will help develop the talented Steven Caulker. In contrast, Leicester’s summer dealings have been uninspiring, with £8m star signing Leonardo Ulloa scoring just 14 times for Brighton and Hove Albion last season. Burnley are 8/13 favourites to be relegated this season and have bolstered their squad in similarly unimpressive fashion to Leicester, with new strikers Lukas Jutkiewicz and Marvin Sordell managing just 15 Championship goals between them last term. QPR’s greater resources have already helped them assemble a fine squad, and they should stretch their advantage further in the final weeks of the transfer window. All Odds and Markets are correct as of the date of publishing.
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Post by harr on Oct 26, 2014 21:12:18 GMT
QPR , Burnley and Leicester in the bottom four as the table stands tonight.
Really surprised how little Burnley invested in players ?
Going to be a long season for all three Clubs .
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Post by corndog on Oct 27, 2014 18:27:31 GMT
I knew Leicester would fall back down eventually. I agree Harr about Burnley, doesn't look like they prepared financially for the season, but at least they have been fighting. Could see them spend a bit in January to try and stay in the league. Leicester had a much better start than QPR and are already falling down the table. So it's time for QPR to start winning.
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Post by sharky on Oct 27, 2014 22:35:39 GMT
So it's time for QPR to start winning. .....and we are!!
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Post by gthompson66 on Oct 27, 2014 23:20:43 GMT
I think Sunderland and Burnley will go down, with us fighting it out with Villa, Palarse and one or two others to avoid the third slot. Got a feeling we might just scrape it through but then I have just watched us win 2-0
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ingham
Dave Sexton
Posts: 1,896
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Post by ingham on Oct 28, 2014 21:32:09 GMT
I find it impossible to work up even a guess about how well or badly we'll do. I always do. I wouldn't be surprised to find them where Southampton are now. Or without a win in the next fifteen. Or any point in between.
Even good players and big clubs get strange results and have (relatively) bad seasons.
I wonder whether we would actually DO better if we didn't make up our minds in advance about the potential either of the Club generally or what a certain manager or squad is capable of achieving.
Shouldn't we be ready for anything? If so, how can we be if we discount the less appealing options and burden the manager with a belief that he will 'get it right'.
Surely the point of the game is that we have to wait and see. If it was as easy as all that to work out in advance, we'd be dominant by now. And so would everyone else.
When was the outcome of a season ever predictable? Especially at smaller Clubs.
If we didn't treat every manager like a miracle worker, might we take a lot of the pressure off? Not so much because it disrupts their efforts to have to put up with maybe unrealistic expectations, just that it makes it so much more difficult for them to please us.
For all the goodwill and the sense that we should get behind them, nobody does for long. Surely, if there must be expectations of some kind - especially given what they are paid - there should be some kind of framework to justify them.
Not just leaving it all to the miracle-worker in the dugout.
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Post by londonranger on Oct 28, 2014 23:53:25 GMT
Fans are dreamers.
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