bowles
Dave Sexton
Posts: 1,939
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Post by bowles on Aug 4, 2010 12:19:04 GMT
At last some one talking some sense! What great ideas. I hope at least a few of them are introduced but im not holding my breath!
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 4, 2010 17:50:48 GMT
It is good to have ideas but when they are commercial notions, emotion must not cloud judgement, thats why clubs are in debt now anyway, A stan or Rodney T shirt might exite and make the best Christmas ever for hardcore fans, but how many can be guaranteed to be sold? Lets just say for one moment that we have all the fans that we are going to have and they have purchased a shirt and some bits and bobs, the aim is to get new fans, now new fans may not hold the history of the club as dear to them as others (yet), so you have to market a product that introduces them to a club, your overseas tourist who has come to watch a game is not going to but anything of any significance, they will buy a souvenir that has london written on it to take home. You local who has been to a game and likes it is going to buy a shirt, not anything hardcore, not straight away. Ask any fan of Man UTD (i dont know any) how many George Best tee's they have in their wardrobes versus the club shirt. Only one Best one, you got one you have got them all I suspect. The Ideas that have been floated around are exiting, but if they are not adopted straight away then this may be a more possitive sign that we are to be prudent, rather than an assertion that they dont get it, either way I dont think you should take it to heart.
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 4, 2010 19:10:53 GMT
Blockhead, I would say that NO products are guaranteed to sell! I would also say that - Marsh & Bowles shirts are not for hardcore fans, they are for QPR fans. We all know them and as England players with QPR on the shirt, we are just proud to show that we have actually had GENUINE legends! There are not many real football fans in general, who have not heard of those 2 + Les Ferdinand & Gerry Francis. (Hardcore -IMO- would be- Ron Hunt, Bobby Keetch, Jim Langley, Mike Kelly, and even Wegerle. Or those QPR players more well known at other Clubs like- Mclintock, Webb, Hollins, Samson, Seaman, Crouch, Les Allen, Langley & Bridges and you could even argue Tony -Sheffield Utd & even Venables!) I also think fans will buy items of players who mean something to them and not care what others think! (I, for example would love a tribute shirt to Dave Clement.) Lets not forget, we are not Man Utd... we have had very few REAL legends who will be remembered. Marsh, Bowles, Francis & Ferdinand I think are those few, and as QPR & England players (Gerry - England Captain), most fans would be proud to wear & show everyone we have had great players! I repeat, we have had very few genuine legends. In contrast, how many players of the last 2 seasons would you proudly wear? i wouldn't wear them if I was given them! Even Gallen, Ainsworth & Cook are unknown beyond QPR. If you had to pick a number 10 to wear, would you wear Marsh, Bowles ... or Buzsaky Fitz Hall or Gerry Francis??? I think that's logic mate, not clouded judgement. As for history & heritage, I proposed that a free pamphlet (That I volunteered to write, with the help of all the ex- players I know and YOU folks, as I know the moderater and others are very strong on the earlier days of the Club.... I'm not!) an easy read history of the Club, to educate people about us, trust me, education is one of our problems- When most people have never heard of our ONLY major trophy Wembley winning Captain- It's obvious it's a problem!!! If new comers have not got the internet, they have to pay £15 for a book (With wrong information... Dave Clement was NOT stabbed to death, he broke his leg, fell into deep depression and killed himself by drinking weed killer! FACT! Gordon Macey is an idiot!!!) to find this info out, that's wrong!!! More of the match day programmes, should also be given over to our heritage. I may be alone, but I don't want to read an exclusive interview with Kaspars Gorkss!!!!) And talking of them, not even the match day programme is guaranteed to sold! ( There should be a small part of the shop, full of past programmes, a lot of people collect them. Instead, there is a huge table upstairs packed sky high with hundreds of old, unsold programmes ready to be chucked! How stupid is that? fans would love them, and for business - What's £3 X 500 That's obvious to me, but not to the genius brains upstairs... and they go back a long way, so there's education right there!!!!) I have NOT suggested anything from pure personal emotion, and I think it's logic, not clouded Judgement. And if a local goes to game & a buys a shirt fine- BUT WHAT SHIRT? the horrible Lotto crap, that makes you look like and advertising board, or a shirt with proper hoops and just the 'REAL' badge on? Choice is the key, and working class prices NOT 150 notes for a pair of white obscene trainers, but 35 notes for slick black trainers, with the real emblem on the heal and QPR on the side (or with a gold signature from one of the players series). Or 60 notes for a paper thin marker rain coat, that ends up in the 9.99 section a few weeks later!!!! As for taking things personally.......... THAT COMES NEXT! I hope I cleared up your question for you mate? Attachments:
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Post by blockhead on Aug 4, 2010 19:24:47 GMT
I dont remember asking a question about that post, but thanks, I do have two questions.
Very true about the match programme, I dont buy one of them, I get AKTURs instead, I was just putting a point of view forward on perhaps why some ideas have not been picked up straight away.
one thing I wanted to know was about the n-power promotion, do you know any thing about a £45 voucher?
as an aside, your views on the latest offerings by lotto are the same as most others, What was the general opinion among fans of having a shirt sponsor for the first time? ( i was a bit small then to remember)
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obk
Dave Sexton
Posts: 1,516
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Post by obk on Aug 4, 2010 20:42:47 GMT
I like the ideas, it's an impressive list. They should at the very least be tried. If it turns out a few of them are not big sellers, the club looses a little money. But I bet a few of them would make some nice money for the club making up for that.
Next part please Terry.
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Post by Lonegunmen on Aug 4, 2010 22:53:17 GMT
Admiral had a small yellow admiral logo on the fron of the shirt, it was unintrusive and did not take up much space at all. this Lotto logo is over the top IMHO. We are paying them to advertise their product!
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 5, 2010 0:51:54 GMT
Sorry lads, don't know anything about recent promotions... you will find out why in part 2 which I will probably do tomorrow. Sorry Blockhead, I thought it was a question for me mate, my apologies. I thought I would let you know that I just got an E-mail from my pal Rodney Marsh. Rodney has been a rock through all this & my main partner in arms. I mailed him yesterday and jokingly said " I'm sure you love me really" His answer was one of the biggest you can give a man these day's (And we all know Rod hates phoney's and fake people!) He simply said " Of course I do mate..... YOUR REAL!" Coming from him, that was special. It also underlines the main difference between myself & Rodney, and the false, Ar** licking, 2 faced, tosspots, I'm going to tell you about tomorrow. I also got an E-mail from him earlier, after I told him I was writing the truth on here. He asked me personally to wish "ALL of you the best, and to ALWAYS do something active if you feel something is unjust and not to just talk about it on a message board." I have to admit, that's been the trouble with QPR fans. Everyone it seems hated the new badge, but who actually DID ANYTHING? Remember when Keegan sold Andy Cole? Newcastle fans made him come out and explain himself. Remember when El Tel was at war with Alan Sugar? Spurs fans were burning season tickets out side the High Court, there were hundreds of them!!! Sorry people, but we for some reason lack that passion, fire in the belly that ignites when an injustice has been done at the Club. Sure, we moan amongst ourselves on here, but that's it! Because NOBODY was prepared to stand up & be counted, the lot 'Upstairs' think all is well. Someone posted ' I see the badge is still the same on the new kit' of course it is, because there is no sense of 'WE ARE ALL ONE' among us, I don't remember loads of QPR fans outside the directors entrance protesting about the new badge... do you? No complaints, so the lot 'upstairs' think that badge is the greatest thing ever, because a community of QPR fans have never got together and made them listen to the fact that they hate it!! So why would they change it? that will now STAY our badge, because the changeover was so smooth. It's not rocket science fellow Hoops is it? I remember when I wanted to present them with a petition for a memorial to Mike Keen and people to E-mail me their names in support. Everyone on here agreed. But I got a link to a petition site and 3!!!.... count 'em 3!!!!... e-mails- one from a Chelsea supporter asking me what the hell was wrong with QPR fans, and that we " Have no spine!!!, if they had of ignored Peter Osgood, there would of been a riot!!!" I had the same comments from Leeds fans about Billy Bremner, Ipswich about Bobby Robson & Sir Alf. West Ham fans about Bobby Moore, Everton fans about Alan Ball... and so many others I can't remember! And the amount of players I have spoken to, QPR players mostly - who can't understand why Stan Bowles is the main idol- when he failed at Man City, Bury, Crewe, Carlisle, Orient, Forrest and would maybe never had made it at QPR if he wasn't surrounded and supported by the England Captain & top internationals like Dave Thomas, Don Givens & Don Masson- ALL great players, Rodney never had that, there wasn't an international among them. But as soon as he joined, we went from division 3 to division1 and beat a first division team to win the first Wembley League Cup on the way!!! Doesn't that tell you ANYTHING about Rodney Marsh & the way he has never been given anywhere near the credit he deserves, by the last 2 generations.. he also made our Club famous!! Ask a casual fan to name a QPR player before Rodney, and they can't do it!! He was our first superstar, genius, entertainer etc, and everything is still Stan this, Stan that?? To back up what I said about he may not have made it at QPR, less than 3 years after leaving us, he was in the third division at Brentford, and he never won ANYTHING!!! I also hear 'Yeah, Stan's one of us, he walks down South Africa Road with us, not like Marsh." Yeah, but Stan NEVER, EVER goes to Loftus Road, he fleets between the Springbok and the betting shop opposite!!! he's admitted himself, he hates watching football. And Rodney's problem there is- he lives in Florida!!! Other Club's staff who I speak to all the time, can't understand it and most of his book was made up! (Knocking the FA Cup off it's stand & dented it from 40 yards and causing a riot.... That was Tony Hazell!!!) As for claiming to be the second best player in the Country, only just behind George Best, that's a classic! Read any book on the early to mid 70's, or ask any player- Rodney, Alan Hudson, Charlie George, Frank Worthington,Jimmy Armfield to name but a few- They will ALL say the second most skillful player at that time, when at Sheffield & Leeds was Tony Currie!!! and you may remember, when Tony Joined QPR, the number 10 shirt was taken straight off Stan and given to Tony- and Tony was shot by then!! Stan say's himself, 'I was ready to walk out, but it went to Tony Currie, the best midfielder there was, so I didn't mind that much.' So what's my point? A) From past experience, NO changes will be made for our benefit at OUR Club, if we let everything go and do NOTHING!! i'm sorry folks, I love you all, but that's the QPR way, 'Somebody will do something soon' NO THEY WON'T- the Club is US!!! No fans- no Club... it's that simple, and when I write things your not going to like, and ask you to mail the right people..... I know about 2 people will do it! THAT'S WHY THE BADGE & EVERYTHING ELSE YOU DON'T LIKE DOESN'T CHANGE!!! Other Clubs are actually laughing at us- do you know that? As for Stan Bowles, everything is just backwards & wrong! I bet if I asked for names for a Stan statue, I would get hundreds, and Mike Keen, Rodney, Gerry & the '67 team would get none! the '76 team who won nothing would, but not the winners! And that really isn't being biased to Rodney because he's a pal, I always said he deserves so much more, and that he made OUR Club, it's through that I got to meet him, so it's the other way around! Message boards are great folks, but unless you take what you hate, on mass, to the 'Suits' Who's gonna hear? and if I do it with no back up from you...... Who's gonna care? Think about it before you slag me off. Because I know for a fact,because I was told by them, if QPR fans had acted like other fans... that badge would of gone! they were thinking about it anyway, but fans kept buying it and no fuss was made......... So it stayed! and that folks.... is a fact!!
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 5, 2010 1:02:23 GMT
Folks, let me sum it up by sharing a saying a man I once knew used to have on the top of his letters.
' Better to live a single day as a satisfied lion...... than a life time as a regretting sheep' REG KRAY.
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Post by Macmoish on Aug 5, 2010 13:00:05 GMT
Thanks Terry
Although as you know - as I've said before: I cherish Rodney Marsh both as a player and a personality and a person (and he very kindly sent my son a mesage of congratulations when he graduated college - something my son and I will always remember and appreciate)...
However I still feel you're a little too harsh on Stan Bowles - The Footballer/competitor - Forget the off the field stuff, etc.
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Post by bp on Aug 5, 2010 14:00:01 GMT
Thanks Terry Although as you know - as I've said before: I cherish Rodney Marsh both as a player and a personality and a person (and he very kindly sent my son a mesage of congratulations when he graduated college - something my son and I will always remember and appreciate)... However I still feel you're a little too harsh on Stan Bowles - The Footballer/competitor - Forget the off the field stuff, etc. I have to say that when comparing Marsh with other No 10s I wholeheartedly agree with Terry. But I would also have to say that there were one or two stars here before Rod'. Brian Bedford and Mark Lazarus to name but 2 of many.
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bowles
Dave Sexton
Posts: 1,939
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Post by bowles on Aug 5, 2010 18:56:34 GMT
I was to young to watch marsh play for us but I saw stan play and to me he was the best player ive ever seen to play in our hooped shirt! I really think as well you have been to harsh on bowles! He was a outstanding player, he inspired me to be a life long rangers fan. I dont know stan personally and I know off the pitch he has been not a very good role model but on the pitch he was a god! I just loved watching that bloke play football as I said with out him I dont think I would be following rangers now!
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finney
Dave Mangnall
Posts: 175
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Post by finney on Aug 5, 2010 21:09:02 GMT
When i was a kid i dreamed of wearing the norn iron shirt like best and the glentoran shirt like Billy Caskey then the first time i got to see the shirt i wanted to be in was when the R's came out at Wembley in the tracksuit tops how class was that i had a new dream.
And i never seen Bowles in the hoops i seen Byrne,Bannister,McDonald,Falco,Sir Les,Willo,The bard and many more we all like a player even when we sold Seaman i thought feck him.
I used to in the day watch the big match them hoops no matter where we sat in this earth we knew what the feck QPR looked like as we were special no one looked like us as even in a black and white TV i knew that Celtic had numbers on the shorts.
For me even as a man i loved Wegerle Wilkins,Barker and Sinton. Marsh and Bowles to me are Iconic as is Thomas with his socks down and body in flow on the wing.
Going back to the shop i hear a lot of good things about Francis and the tours are class and i know a few people who have loved them. The club will get its head right one day and show the world again our past and glory and our roots it all takes a wee bit of time.
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 5, 2010 21:16:05 GMT
A God that won NOTHING! Great! Lads, you are missing the point here completely. Brian Bedford & Mark Lazarus can be named by learned QPR fans, buy I said casual football & casual QPR fans- Could not name a QPR player before Rodney! Can I remind you, I grew up in the Stan era and I also know him. And if you know him, you will know he's an addict, prone to heavy mood swings & completely unreliable! I thought Stan was great, a maverick, a showman.... but NOT a genius- big difference! One Man who WAS a genius & we can't argue about that fact - was George Best. He said many times " You can't be a genius if you can't kick with both feet" Stan, as we all know was one footed! As for ' If it wasn't for Stan, I may not have followed QPR' that's your generation & your personal life soundtrack. Younger fans say that about Ferdinand, Sinclair & Wegerle. That's not concrete! OK, lads lets hear it. As I said before, I don't believe in 'Sorry mate, Bowles was better all the way!!!' and ' I think your being too harsh on Stan Bowles' NOBODY has actually said WHY??? Read what I have written about Stan, and please tell my the parts that are not true, what parts have I made up? what can you tell me, i'm wrong about??? ( And I don't mean "Stan was just better mate!" or " Marsh was not as good as Bowles") TELL ME WHY? What did I say that wasn't true? GO FOR IT!!
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Post by cpr on Aug 6, 2010 6:05:56 GMT
I have much to say but have said most of it.
Far too early for proper input so more to follow.
Seen both play, never met Marsh, have met Bowles a number of times.
ROD IS GOD, STAN IS THE MAN
;D
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Post by spiderwales on Aug 6, 2010 11:54:00 GMT
fantastic stuff terry gear that the fans want, at affordable prices- we as you say the hard part is making the numpties upstiars hear us !
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 6, 2010 22:06:43 GMT
Spot on Spider, if we had a Chairman who was part of the Clubs history, like Gordon Banks at Stoke, we wouldn't have these problems. Imagine, if say, Gerry Francis , Les Allen or Ian Gillard over looked that part of the Club (I only use these as examples of people who really know the Club & fans.) I was flicking through old programmes last night, and in '97 ('91 - '97- I always refer to as our last 'Golden Era' - with players like- Wegerle, Sinclair, Ferdinand, Sinton, Wilkins, Barker, Gallen & Parker all playing within that period- But like everything, I don't think we appreciated what we had then.) But running down the staff list- John Hollins, Warren Neill, Tony Ingham, & Gary Micklewhite were all involved with the Club. Now, look down the staff list!!!! I found it amazing that loyal R's- Kevin Gallen, Lee Cook & Gareth Ainsworth (Who got us out the crap everytime we were between Managers!) ALL left the Club about the same time, preferring to take wage cuts at Clubs like Wycombe & Luton ... rather than stay...... and hardly anyone thought something must be seriously wrong!!! and that doesn't include the Managers- ( If anyone was lucky enough to be at the Preston N.E. match, last October under Magilton, you will agree it was football of the highest quality, attacking their left flank, going past players and crossing for some awesome finishes, was a buzz and one of our best games (I.M.O))) Finney, I can assure you my friend, that there is nothing different about Francis Atkinson, than any of the others. You may remember, that I actually asked people on here to E-mail him and tell him what a great job he was doing? (I'm sure the Mod can find that post.) The reason for this was, NOT actually to congratulate him, but to encourage him to stay in the mind set I put him in, and to carry on & push through all those ideas I laid out!!! THAT was the REAL reason! (Now, if I sound like i am forever blowing my own trumpet, that is NOT the case. But you have seen my ideas, and you saw them & I asked you to add things when they were presented to the Club. EVERYTHING, I am telling you, I swear on my beloved Fathers grave is 100% TRUE! NOTHING has been changed to fit my story!!) So most of the good feedback on Francis came from ME. Francis, is a jobs worth. He is S**t scared of authority and his Bosses, and will ALWAY'S agree with upstairs, for fear of losing his job! I on the other hand will stand my views all the way, I hate authority, have NO respect for them and if they sack me for being true to myself- FU** 'Em!!! I have been that way since School and before. I co- wrote a book about myself & Roy Shaw's visits to Ronnie Biggs in Belmarsh and the treatment he was getting. On the day of his release, I did a live phone interview for SKY NEWS. I told them "Compassion? what do they know about compassion? how can they decide that my mate Charlie Bronson is too violent to be released, while dropping bombs on civilians in another American War, that will be another Vietnam??? They are all power crazed, sex crazed W**kers, and should all be sent to the Afghan front line! Jack Straw's Brother is a convicted nonce (True.) They are all F**king useless, and every one of the B**tards should be F**king shot!!!" That shook MR studio man, but the fact is how many people would keep to their beliefs to that extent? I can tell you, people I thought lived & died to stay who they were, have buckled when they got to a certain level, to me.... I just HAD to say it! My book after the QPR book i'm writing at the moment (I may call upon comments from YOU!) will be a sort of ' Wake up to whose in 'power' ' sort of book. So, you can see that I would NEVER understand, the Francis Atkinson's of the world! On one occasion, he was wearing jeans, which is not allowed. He saw a boss and actually hid... hid!!! the man is 48!!!! Rodney & I looked at each other like ' What a wa**er!' he had one face for me, another for Rodney, and another for the lot upstairs... I HATE 'men' like that. So the reason I put out so much good propaganda about him, was a method hoping enough e-mails telling him the new ideas of MINE were great, would give him some spine! During the week, you can only enter the shop by pressing a buzzer on the left side door. Knowing that Rod was coming in as well, he put a printed track- top, with MARSH and RM-10 on it. RM-10, as I have explained came from me. And he put it right by the door, he knew Rod was coming in. After, I said "Well, I'm having one of those, you have nicked my design." he told the girls, that I was having one, as I designed it. So upon looking for an XL, I saw that EVERY other top was plain!!! It was just a rack of those market 'Retro track - tops' they sell & he had just printed one, so Rodney could see it when he walked in!!!!!! Now, what does that tell you about the REAL Manager of our Shop?? it actually made me cringe. He then went about telling Rodney about all these great Marsh & '67 ideas, HE had come up with. But anything like that, I had E-mailed to Rod first for approval, then to Francis- Obviously, Rodney (A VERY astute man anyway.) saw right through him. He never showed Rodney around the shop, because all they had was one framed photo with Rod's printed signature on, that they NEVER had permission to use! it was taken from a shirt, Rod had signed for charity and it had a number 10 after his name. I have over 100 Rodney signatures, not one has a 10 on it!! Not a lot angers Rodney about QPR anymore, he really doesn't care for any of this lot, but one thing I & Francis knew would wind him up! (And it's a no-brainer considering our history.) Among the '76 & '82 stuff- there was NO white '67 League Cup winning top!!!! As the only trophy we have won of any value, as a third division team beating a first division team, after being 2-0 down at Half- Time, the first to be played at Wembley, and the ONLY time we ever wore that white shirt, and the only one we could put 'Winners' on .... AND THERE ISN'T ONE!!! Just think about that for a second from a QPR fans point of view. We lost the '76 title & '82 FA CUP & the '86 Milk/League Cup, so we have one shirt we can REALLY be proud of, with ' WINNERS- WEMBLEY' on it..... and it's not there? Or the Track top which I proposed, or the Hoops we won the League in that Double winning year. Are you starting to see, that they DO NOT have a clue yet??? I Also suggested, something while everyone was gripped by World Cup Fever. They came out with Club & Country shorts... which are beige!!! beige??? have you seen England or QPR in beige shorts? and a ST George's Cross on one leg and the new logo on the other. I meant ' ENGLAND WORLD CHAMPIONS '66' under the cross on one leg, and ' QPR DOUBLE WINNERS '67' under a Hammersmith badge on the other.... And the shorts to be WHITE!!! (Both our colours!). The top was even better, a Club & Country- thick RUGBY SHIRT??? Do you remember how hot it was in July? Why not get the proper Umbro '66 England WHITE shirt (We only wore red in the final.) but England wore until '74. It was worn by the '66 team and Rodney, Stan, Gerry, Terry Venables, Dave Thomas & Ian GIllard. Or put a 10 on the back, and maybe have 'AS worn by '66 World Cup Hero Geoff Hurst & QPR'S Genius number 10's- Rodney Marsh & Stan Bowles sewn on in small writing under the badge?? The Blue England Track- Top with white writing, at a nice £30 - Which would you prefer? But NO!.... beige shorts & a Rugby top it was!! And really, The 60's hooped 'Rodney Shirt' that has NEVER been on sale, Before the day's of replica shirts, the players couldn't keep them, and NOBODY except QPR are licensed to make (You have seen the 'Toffs' version?) and is easily our most iconic shirt EVER! The shirt we won the league in on our double winning jaunt in '67, worn by - Rodney, Les Allen, Mark Lazarus, The Morgans, Tony Hazell & Mike Keen, but also - Barry Bridges, Dave Clement, Terry Venables, Gerry Francis, Terry Mancini, Dave Thomas and of course Stan Bowles... and so many more, it's the purest example of ' SUPER HOOPS', it's history is unchallenged, and what most people think of when you say QPR........... And until I pointed this out, QPR had NEVER stocked it, so it just did not exist!..... It doesn't take a genius to think ' Well, obviously we have to stock that!, the red & white split away tops etc can come after.' But it was NEVER considered. That was my obvious starting point, the bulk of our legends wore it, and (IMO) it's still the best looking shirt we ever had as 'Hoops' (Compare it to the Lotto shirts!) Any fan, who knows who wore that shirt would be proud to have it, it screams ' WE ARE A GREAT TEAM!) Not to mention the money they would make, because you can't buy it anywhere except at OUR shop.... and it never even entered their heads? ?? Or is it me that's mad? Next time, we carry on with personal experiences and start getting personal! Love 'Ya all!!! Tel Attachments:
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 6, 2010 22:18:20 GMT
Oh, I was going to mention the tours. I have been on one, they are conducted by a fella called Dave Robinson. They are good, not great. I don't think you could beat a tour of your Club, conducted by a former well known player. Someone who can tell you personal stories, what they thought of other players/managers, their best games, opposition etc, etc,. A tour of OUR Club, with one of OUR players would be the icing on the Hooped cake! Attachments:
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ingham
Dave Sexton
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Post by ingham on Aug 6, 2010 22:44:25 GMT
Clive Clark too. Though he nearly buried us singlehandedly at Wembley. What a goal machine that side was.
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Post by Lonegunmen on Aug 6, 2010 22:48:40 GMT
Question.
After the League Cup win and the lads went back to the hooped shirt, was there a club badge on the front with League Cup winners stitched in below it? Now if so, That too, would be a shirt worth getting (3XL) I could never understand why we were not allowed to wear hoops against West Broms red.
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 7, 2010 1:57:31 GMT
No mate, we just went back to plain hoops, with no badge at all. The Hammersmith badge was on the teams blazers, but no badge was on the actual shirt. But it was all the covers of the programmes for a long time. I have been told be all the '67 team that Alex Stock took a nice 'Drink' in a brown envelope from the kit makers, to wear those white shirts! Stock's official explanation to the players was, if we wear all white, just like Real Madrid, we will feel more confident, and have an edge. But the lads all say, it was a bung!!! It was not a big deal in those day's.
As for Clive Clark, he had come from QPR, so I think he knew how to play us. The Danger man was supposed to be Jeff Astle, so we had him covered. But as you say mate, Clark ran riot that day. He is now extremely ill and in a nursing home i'm sad to say.
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Post by Lonegunmen on Aug 7, 2010 6:41:35 GMT
A mate of mine here in NZ whom uses this very site, was at that cup final. Lucky bugger he is. I think I was born either 10 years too early or ten years too late.
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Post by Macmoish on Aug 7, 2010 7:03:53 GMT
It was just before that game - which I didn't see - that someone at my school asked Do you want QPR or WBA to win...and that's when it began. My first game - and the first time I went to a football game - was at Loftus Road in November or December 1967 as we were pursuing the truly incredible of promotion to Division One.
Whatever we achieved in 1966/67 with the Promotion/League Cup Triumph -or under Jago or Sexton or Venables, I'd always argue what we achieved the following season (In which Marsh missed a big chunk), in that promotion was both amazing - and magic - and just truly, truly beyond belief.
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obk
Dave Sexton
Posts: 1,516
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Post by obk on Aug 7, 2010 9:34:17 GMT
Terryloftus wrote: "I found it amazing that loyal R's- Kevin Gallen, Lee Cook & Gareth Ainsworth (Who got us out the crap everytime we were between Managers!) ALL left the Club about the same time, preferring to take wage cuts at Clubs like Wycombe & Luton ... rather than stay...... and hardly anyone thought something must be seriously wrong!!! "
Amazing is the word!
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bowles
Dave Sexton
Posts: 1,939
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Post by bowles on Aug 7, 2010 10:48:33 GMT
Terry what you said the other day about stan got me thinking. You are right in a way that we do get to focused on one player and seem to forget the others. I asked my dad the other night who is 82 year old r,s fan who he thought was the best player to ever where the hooped shirt and couldnt give me an answer he says there have been so many. He then started rattleing off names of players ive never heard of! It just showed me how little I really know about our wonderful club. I think its about time I started learning!!
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Post by saphilip on Aug 7, 2010 13:43:06 GMT
A helluva lot of writing & messages on this thread. I cannot comment much about Rod and probably not much more for Stan but in many respects what QPR did in during the 75/76 season almost matches what happened in 1967.
Let's face it cup matches are lotteries (and I am by no means belittling our 1967 LC win) while winning a Div 3 title must to some extent play second fiddle to coming 2nd in Div 1 - especially during a time when we faced Liverpool in their early pomp, a Man Utd side who were by no means crap and the like of Ipswich, Leeds & Derby.
The fact that we won both the LC and the Div 3 title in the same season makes 1967 a great season, but 1976 shouldn't rate too far behind (and neither should the period 1982-1985).
To me I don't really care what Stan did at other clubs it is what he did at QPR that matters - and in that capacity he did bloody wonders for us. Who cares what happened at Forest or Carlisle, to me (and thousands of other Rs fans) he was the greatest QPR player of all time.
As for the powers that be at QPR why the surprise? These guys couldn't run the proverbial booze up and the less said about their marketing, the better, because it is non existent.
We have been a club that has always managed to miss the boat. We failed to take full advantage of our plastic pitch, we failed to buy land that was available at the time that would have allowed us to expand LR, and everytime we were on the verge of something great we managed to stuff it up.
But most of all we totally missed the sugar daddy boat. While our neighbours found Al Fayad & Abarmovich, we were stuck with Chris Wright & Richard Thompson. And when we thought we had struck oil with the so called dream team of Flabio, the Mittals & Ecclestone we found we hit mud instead.
That's QPR for you - the club that always misses the big opportunities, with rank amateurs running it.
So no, I can't say I would be surprised if you were to tell us that the powers that be rejected your ideas. That type of blinkered thinking has been part and parcel of QPR for over 15 years now - and to be honest I see nothing in the current regime to suggest that this attitude will change in the near future.
Oh and while I agree with the commenst about the likes of Gallen & co leaving QPR for other teams, a fair number of fans said good riddance to them and refused to accept that there were problems at QPR. Even now many fans refuse to see what is happening in front of them.
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Post by terryloftus on Aug 8, 2010 0:23:57 GMT
Yes, Cup games are a lottery, but it's not just one game is it, it's a campaign with different rounds and you have to get through all those hurdles first, while concentrating on the League. Wembley is just the finale of a long fought out Cup run, That's not a lottery, that's form & consistency, home & away. Perhaps the 2 leg Semi Final against Birmingham was that teams greatest achievement. A 2 legged semi, away & at home, isn't a lottery. So you can't remember Rodney & not much more about Stan- BUT, Stan is the ' Greatest Player Of All Time???' And he worked wonders in '76.... what wonders exactly are we referring too? Remember, in his first season, Stan was just about top scorer, every season after- it was Don Givens by a mile! I would say winning the League Cup (When it was a huge deal!) being in the third division & beating a First division team (Who were the holders.), The first ever to be played at Wembley, that's why the original Cup is still at the Club, after being in Bobby Keetch's room until 4-5am getting completely hammered, because we were enjoying every second of the journey of punching way above our weight and just doing it 'OUR WAY!' and then going out to the deafening noise of 'Rod-Neee, Rod-Neee' to a drum beat, that didn't let up for 90 minutes, scoring our first ever Wembley goal, and only ever winning Wembley goal, and Rodney's 'Wonder Goal' against first class defenders and not dropping our heads after going 2-0 down in the first half..... Was FAR superior to coming second in '76!! Something, only QPR fans will remember as nobody else would care about who came second.. can you remember all the second places since? who cares??? We have very young fans it seems now, and soon Stan's legacy will fade. It's alway's worth talking to our older supporters and asking them who they thought was the best. You will get some interesting answers like- Les Allen, Tony Ingham, Brian Bedford, Mark Lazarus, Dave Clement, Mike Keen, and a man who was England's number one goalkeeper, before Banks, was the first to be called ' The Cat' and although was at Sheff Weds at the time, (But was at QPR before & came back after) was a member of the England '66 World Cup Squad- Ron Springett. Also Tony Hazell, Frank Sibley, Ron Hunt, JImmy Langley, Peter Springett, The Morgan twins, Mick Leach, Barry Bridges, Don Rogers, Vic Mobley, John Delve, Frank Clark, Alan Wilks, Alan Harris, Clive Clark, Frank Saul, Mike Kelly and a man who played a key role in the final, who was only semi-pro... Keith Sanderson. Those players have now been more or less cast into history. But talk to ANYONE from QPR who was at Wembley in '67 and they will tell you, what an incredible miracle we pulled off (It was also our first T.V. appearance!!), one old guy I was speaking too last season, had tears streaming down his face just remembering that day, and one lovely old women was chocked up telling me, that fans now don't realize how emotional it all was, and today they don't appreciate it or even care! Mark Lazarus, told me " What they don't realize is without us, there would of been no Stan Bowles or Gerry Francis or that '70's lot. We climbed the hill, we laid down the foundations and made that team famous and wealthy, we could easily have been another Workington or Mansfield who we were playing in those day's! But Rodney joined, it was the missing piece and we went from low in division 3 to division 1, plus the League Cup. We couldn't stay in division 1 because they tried to not spend and carried on with a 3rd division team, and you can't do that! You can't enter a top division with players like Best, Charlton & Law in it, and not buy good players. But suddenly, we were playing the Man Utd's, Arsenal's, Liverpools & Spurs every week. The hatchet men were all out for Rodney, i'm surprised they didn't break every bone in his body to stop him, he was a genius and they knew it, so they did all they could do- kick lumps out of him.Now, they would be out injured for the rest of the season, after some of the attacks he took. One season, 2 of them snapped his leg in half by hitting him at different sides, I remember the SNAP! echo round the ground, but he still tried to get up!!!! Football then was full of hackers, who were absolutely useless at playing football, but could stop stop the greats from playing, that's was all they could do, double stud players from the back!! and those type of negative players like- Jack Charlton, Norman Hunter, Tommy Smith , Nobby Stiles & Ron Harris would end up in the England squad, and the Rodney's, Tony Currie, Barry Bridges, Peter Osgood, Alan Hudson, Charlie Cooke and all those gifted magicians were left out!!!! For those who weren't there, I could never explain what effect it had on the country, these little nobody's doing what we did. Every other London team was supporting us, and from there the gates increased and we had to build new stands FAST!! Nobody was interested in our funny little Club before that, it was all Fulham, Chelsea & even Brentford, but then with Rodney, we took off like a rocket! QPR changed when he joined, he is easily the greatest player ever to play for QPR, no competition. Anyone who say's Bowles was better or so & so was better, obviously never saw them both play, they are going on rumour and all the made up stuff in Bowle's book which, I put down for good after claiming doing all these things, that others actually done. All that reading a paper while playing, someone would throw a can of lager on the pitch, Rodney would open it & drink it while ghosting past the opposition. Rodney would warm up by juggling an orange the length of the pitch and a coin on the way back!!! All the stuff about the 10 shirt being magic, that was only because Rodney wore it, it was just another shirt before that.And of course that genius goal at Wembley, but people forget that he had actually banged an acrobatic overhead kick in before that, but was ruled off side- I never believed it was. Then Rodney was bought for so much money, they bought Bowles, Givens & Thomas, finished building the stand and still had cash to spare. The biggest mistake QPR made was not signing Tony Currie when they had the chance. If they had, nobody would be talking about Stan Bowles today. Appreciate Bowles, but not at the expense of Rodney Marsh or any of that team, because we were the first winning side, and unlike Bowles, Rodney didn't have internationals everywhere running around to give him the ball, and look how far he took us! We and especially Rodney MADE that Club, I would like you all to appreciate that. Everyone is entitled to their favourites, but it's a shame that we and Rodney who was a genuine genius, are sidelined. And i still mantain, that anyone who thinks Bowles was a more skillful player than Marsh, never saw Rodney play very much! (Wembley was not his best game!), they are youngsters floating away on myth of Bowles. And having seen how you fans treat us, and your first superstar genius, entertainer, who made the Club World famous....... is very, very, sad indeed." Mark. I agree, Stan Bowles should be a legend we can be proud of, who played in a different decade for QPR than Rodney. BY all means love Stan (Not by what others say, but finding out yourself!!!) But not at the expense of Rodney. The Beatles were the biggest thing ever........ But there would not have been a Beatles without Elvis..... He kicked the doors down, took the stick and opened the way!!!! It's about time we respected ALL our Legends, but especially those who made our Club famous, and known for great football! I use the word for only a few people..... But Rodney Marsh was an original genius, Stan Bowles tried to keep up that role that was filled before him..... and he done it extremely well! They are BOTH, different types of legends and certainly worlds apart as men! We should feel proud, that we had BOTH!!! TEL P.S. I'm trying to tell you what happened next in my story, and you keep throwing me off!!!! HA! Attachments:
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Post by Lonegunmen on Aug 8, 2010 3:00:37 GMT
Thanks Terry, the above pic is now my wallpaper!
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Post by Macmoish on Aug 8, 2010 8:13:10 GMT
Just for you Terry (and anyone else ) I'm reposting some video of RODNEEE playing for Fulham over forty-four years ago. (Some will notice some other soon-to-be QPR Players of the Fulham lineup)
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Post by Lonegunmen on Aug 9, 2010 3:51:10 GMT
Can you imagine a manager having the balls to play a 2-3-5 formation these days??
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finney
Dave Mangnall
Posts: 175
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Post by finney on Aug 11, 2010 9:32:26 GMT
The tours are a great start by the club to try and do something to bring the fans in and see what is going on. It has had so many good reports and is done by people who care about our club and want to bring people into what we know is Queen's Park Rangers. Also good to see the shop with the Hammersmith badge at last one club badge at the ground that i like. I urge all people who can to take the tour well worth it.
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