nico
Ian Holloway
banned
Posts: 256
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Post by nico on Feb 24, 2010 23:25:44 GMT
One reason I like Mike’s site is it gives some space for reasoned debate from people with different opinions. And we all know football is all about, amongst other things, different opinions. If we all agreed it would be very boring.
So even though I have steadfastly refused to get involved, for a couple of years now, in the pro v anti Gianni side show I hope you don’t mind if tonight I offer an alternative view of things.
I had dinner with Gianni tonight enjoying Chelsea’s defeat. We discussed some of the past. It struck me that sometimes, in all the rage, we forget the bigger picture. This is now the 7th football season Gianni has been crucially involved in QPR. In the first, when he stepped in with much needed investment which potentially saved a club not long out of administration from going back into the dark hole we got promoted to the Championship. In every year since we have managed to maintain the club in this division and stave away administration. That alone is no mean feet when you go back and consider the position the club was in before.
Gianni was also instrumental in bringing in a number of new investors, from Antonio Caliendo, Franco Zanotti, Carlos Dunga, Flavio Briatore to the Mittals. Things haven’t been easy, and our expectations of what might come from these investors have sometimes been cruelly smashed. But we have survived it all, and I think the current situation we are in, from the standpoint of financial stability and future potential is without doubt the best in recent history. Of course none of us know yet, but I hope the new owners, and the new Chairman of Holdings will be the best for the club we have had in recent history.
There are so many criticisms of personal style, past mistakes and utterances that can be argued over until the cows come home, but that for me is the bigger picture. And at the same time, despite all of the sometimes heated allegations made, I have never been award of any serious wrongdoing by Gianni. Despite what some have alleged, he has never been bankrupt, and he has never been alleged to have been involved in any serious irregularity. In my position, I would be the first to disassociate myself from anyone involved in ‘dodgy deals’ in football. In my long association with Gianni I have never seen any evidence of that. In fact, given the militancy of some of his critics I think it would be most surprising if any wrongdoing had occurred and not been exposed. Even the most powerful cannot get away with keep such conduct, as the exposure of allegations concerning a former chairman in another sport demonstrate.
So stepping back from the spats, and looking at the bigger picture, I think we find a good explanation why proven and intelligent business investors in the club continue to have confidence in the man who has guided the club through difficult times and maintained our financial position and championship status.
Now I know my view will be in a minority on this particular site. That’s fine and I am happy with everyone to disagree. I have not engaged in personal attack or vilification, and I hope those who disagree can show a similar restraint. But these are my genuine reflections, not held through having any axe to grind, or for any desire for favours or freebies, and I think it is only good for reasoned debate and discussion for such views to be reasonably aired from time to time.
I shan’t get involved in a running argument about Gianni, for the reasons I have avoided it before. I really don’t think it is that important for the future of the club to engage in such a debate. Whatever is said on messageboards I now think it likely Gianni will continue in his role as Chairman of the football club for years to come, and so I fear constant arguments about this will only be a waste of energy. Those who know him well, and work with him, seem to know Gianni is the best person for the role he has.
More important now, in my opinion, is what plans for investment the new owners have, who manages the team and what decisions they take, and how the players perform on the pitch as a result.
Just a different view of the bigger picture, and I am grateful to Mike for allowing me to give it just this once.
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Post by QPR Report on Feb 24, 2010 23:30:29 GMT
One reason I like Mike’s site is it gives some space for reasoned debate from people with different opinions. And we all know football is all about, amongst other things, different opinions. If we all agreed it would be very boring. So even though I have steadfastly refused to get involved, for a couple of years now, in the pro v anti Gianni side show I hope you don’t mind if tonight I offer an alternative view of things. I had dinner with Gianni tonight enjoying Chelsea’s defeat. We discussed some of the past. It struck me that sometimes, in all the rage, we forget the bigger picture. This is now the 7th football season Gianni has been crucially involved in QPR. In the first, when he stepped in with much needed investment which potentially saved a club not long out of administration from going back into the dark hole we got promoted to the Championship. In every year since we have managed to maintain the club in this division and stave away administration. That alone is no mean feet when you go back and consider the position the club was in before. Gianni was also instrumental in bringing in a number of new investors, from Antonio Caliendo, Franco Zanotti, Carlos Dunga, Flavio Briatore to the Mittals. Things haven’t been easy, and our expectations of what might come from these investors have sometimes been cruelly smashed. But we have survived it all, and I think the current situation we are in, from the standpoint of financial stability and future potential is without doubt the best in recent history. Of course none of us know yet, but I hope the new owners, and the new Chairman of Holdings will be the best for the club we have had in recent history. There are so many criticisms of personal style, past mistakes and utterances that can be argued over until the cows come home, but that for me is the bigger picture. And at the same time, despite all of the sometimes heated allegations made, I have never been award of any serious wrongdoing by Gianni. Despite what some have alleged, he has never been bankrupt, and he has never been alleged to have been involved in any serious irregularity. In my position, I would be the first to disassociate myself from anyone involved in ‘dodgy deals’ in football. In my long association with Gianni I have never seen any evidence of that. In fact, given the militancy of some of his critics I think it would be most surprising if any wrongdoing had occurred and not been exposed. Even the most powerful cannot get away with keep such conduct quite, as the exposure of allegations concerning a former chairman in another sport demonstrate. So stepping back from the spates, and looking at the bigger picture, I think we find a good explanation why proven and intelligent business investors in the club continue to have confidence in the man who has guided the club through difficult times and maintained our financial position and championship status. Now I know my view will be in a minority on this particular site. That’s fine and I am happy with everyone to disagree. I have not engaged in personal attack or vilification, and I hope those who disagree can show a similar restraint. But these are my genuine reflections, not held through having any axe to grind, or for any desire for favours or freebies, and I think it is only good for reasoned debate and discussion for such views to be reasonably aired from time to time. I shan’t get involved in a running argument abbot Gianni, for the reasons I have avoided it before. I really don’t think it is that important for the future of the club to engage in such a debate. Whatever is said on messageboards I now think it likely Gianni will continue in his role as Chairman of the football club for years to come, and so I fear constant arguments about this will only be a waste of energy. Those who know him well, and work with him, seem to know Gianni is the best person for the role he has. More important now, in my opinion, is what plans for investment the new owners have, who manages the team and what decisions they take, and how the players perform on the pitch as a result. Just a different view of the bigger picture, and I am grateful to Mike for allowing me to give it just this once. Well Nico, I imagine your post migh evoke some reactions (possibly even from me)! But firstly, I do want to thank you for posting your views. And as a messageboard Moderator, I and my fellow moderators try to distinguish between offering our own views. AND wanting for this site to offer a forum to hear all QPR perspectives (as long as they're done within the board rules)
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Post by eastpaddoknutta on Feb 24, 2010 23:30:53 GMT
ive said it on watrb we should create a seperate forum for all the "paladini" "sousa" "Flabio" Threads
new people who come to the message boards get put off by all the shite tbh and a few people mention it
i love qpr and it feels great to say this again
any way
u r'ssssssssssssssssssssss!!!!!!
cheers nico
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Post by toboboly on Feb 24, 2010 23:32:06 GMT
Can I just ask why GP cares about Chelsea losing?
A) It's not like it will effect us in any way, shape or form for quite some time yet.
B) He said he was a Port Vale fan when he tried to take them over. Even if he wants QPR to do well, which would hopefully be a given considering where he works, he isn't a fan like somebody that has followed the team out of love.
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finney
Dave Mangnall
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Post by finney on Feb 24, 2010 23:36:22 GMT
Nick De Marco why did Gianni end up in court with Brian Hassle ? And was he in a court case with M'boro?
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Post by klr on Feb 24, 2010 23:50:35 GMT
One reason I like Mike’s site is it gives some space for reasoned debate from people with different opinions. And we all know football is all about, amongst other things, different opinions. If we all agreed it would be very boring. So even though I have steadfastly refused to get involved, for a couple of years now, in the pro v anti Gianni side show I hope you don’t mind if tonight I offer an alternative view of things. I had dinner with Gianni tonight enjoying Chelsea’s defeat. We discussed some of the past. It struck me that sometimes, in all the rage, we forget the bigger picture. This is now the 7th football season Gianni has been crucially involved in QPR. In the first, when he stepped in with much needed investment which potentially saved a club not long out of administration from going back into the dark hole we got promoted to the Championship. In every year since we have managed to maintain the club in this division and stave away administration. That alone is no mean feet when you go back and consider the position the club was in before. Gianni was also instrumental in bringing in a number of new investors, from Antonio Caliendo, Franco Zanotti, Carlos Dunga, Flavio Briatore to the Mittals. Things haven’t been easy, and our expectations of what might come from these investors have sometimes been cruelly smashed. But we have survived it all, and I think the current situation we are in, from the standpoint of financial stability and future potential is without doubt the best in recent history. Of course none of us know yet, but I hope the new owners, and the new Chairman of Holdings will be the best for the club we have had in recent history. There are so many criticisms of personal style, past mistakes and utterances that can be argued over until the cows come home, but that for me is the bigger picture. And at the same time, despite all of the sometimes heated allegations made, I have never been award of any serious wrongdoing by Gianni. Despite what some have alleged, he has never been bankrupt, and he has never been alleged to have been involved in any serious irregularity. In my position, I would be the first to disassociate myself from anyone involved in ‘dodgy deals’ in football. In my long association with Gianni I have never seen any evidence of that. In fact, given the militancy of some of his critics I think it would be most surprising if any wrongdoing had occurred and not been exposed. Even the most powerful cannot get away with keep such conduct, as the exposure of allegations concerning a former chairman in another sport demonstrate. So stepping back from the spats, and looking at the bigger picture, I think we find a good explanation why proven and intelligent business investors in the club continue to have confidence in the man who has guided the club through difficult times and maintained our financial position and championship status. Now I know my view will be in a minority on this particular site. That’s fine and I am happy with everyone to disagree. I have not engaged in personal attack or vilification, and I hope those who disagree can show a similar restraint. But these are my genuine reflections, not held through having any axe to grind, or for any desire for favours or freebies, and I think it is only good for reasoned debate and discussion for such views to be reasonably aired from time to time. I shan’t get involved in a running argument about Gianni, for the reasons I have avoided it before. I really don’t think it is that important for the future of the club to engage in such a debate. Whatever is said on messageboards I now think it likely Gianni will continue in his role as Chairman of the football club for years to come, and so I fear constant arguments about this will only be a waste of energy. Those who know him well, and work with him, seem to know Gianni is the best person for the role he has. More important now, in my opinion, is what plans for investment the new owners have, who manages the team and what decisions they take, and how the players perform on the pitch as a result. Just a different view of the bigger picture, and I am grateful to Mike for allowing me to give it just this once. With all due respect, you are someone who used to work at QPR, not someone who has QPR in their blood like me & the others on this site, Gianni Paladini also doesnt have this club in his blood & never will, Blood runs thicker than water as they say. People that have this club in their blood tend to hold the welfare & good name of this club in a higher regard & esteem than someone like you or Paladini. Personally speaking, I just feel sickened to see him at the club & cant really be bothered to return whilst he is still there, dont agree with him still being able to make money out of my football club, actually it feels immoral to me. Horses for courses though.
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Post by superckat on Feb 25, 2010 0:33:51 GMT
Thanks for your post Nico and you are more than entitled to express your views. However for almost every view like yours. There will be opposing views by people who have not enjoyed the Paladini experience as you may have. Some have been, ranted at during AGM's shouted at threatened, etc etc. I don't know the full details on these, but you just need to read around the various sites to know what I mean.
I don't know him and I'm not interested in meeting him either. I am only interested in the job he has done for the club. In his time here I have far from impressed. He has dragged the club through the courts, had us ridiculed by the media and by other fans. His ousting of Bill Power was disgraceful, his treatment and reason for getting rid of Holloway just as disgraceful. I also believe he used Waddock to smooth the passage to get Gregory in. It was obvious that Waddock wasn't ready for the position and after an unsuccesful trial period he was given the job. Yet I heard Gregory was offered the Managers job well before the gun incident. It was put to me that Holloway was going to be removed and Gregory would be in. That was by someone who is not a QPR supporter and has nothing to with the club. For that reason, I told him he was wrong. I saw him a couple of weeks later and he said he checked and that was definitely the case. This was at least 6 months before Olly was suspended. Waddock had a bad trial yet was offered a contract. Did even worse and was then replaced by Gregory who came in to save the day. It all seems a bit staged to me.
Add on contract disputes, loans from chairmen of another club, loans from the club, his incompotence in the transfer market. his incompotence on contract negotiations, his ability to not shut his mouth. Didn't we almost lose Briatorie and Ecclestone buying the club because, before anything had been finalised he was on the radio bragging about the deal giving the impression it WAS completed. There is also the question did he go out and find FB and BE or did they find him. They were already looking to invest in a football club. I'm sure I read that in an article somewhere.
A lot of directors/chairmen etc who have dealt with him don't trust him. I'm sure you probably already know that. There is so much other stuff that could be brought up without really trying too hard, but it's all been said before and by those a lot more intelligent and articulate than me. But in summary he has shown himself time and time again, to be untrustworthy, incompotent, dishonest, disingenious, immoral and highly skilled at self preservation.
That is my opinion. I am not trying to take away your experience of GP. I also have no problem of you sticking up for him. But I see him through different eyes than you do. I feel he his is dragging this club down and we will never fulfill our true potential as long as he is sitting in a DOF and or Chairman position.
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Post by londonranger on Feb 25, 2010 0:44:34 GMT
Superckat a terriffic post. Cant see anyone more articulate here. Youve absoluteley covered it like a blanket with thorns attached.
Just to ad the grotesque dispatching of Sousa, the undermining of players the 47 players coming in and the dispatching of some very good players. But just look at our position today. a broken team, a manager doing his last match and number10 coming in and we are FIFTEEN POINTS AWAY FROM BEING SAFE FROM RELEGATION. I didnt make this up, No one would ever believe this if they were reading the history of football.
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Post by oliverjames on Feb 25, 2010 0:51:47 GMT
Nico posted: Those who know him well, and work with him, seem to know Gianni is the best person for the role he has.
This is the bigger picture sir. Other people have met him, know him well and have worked with him and think differently.
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Post by londonranger on Feb 25, 2010 1:29:04 GMT
Well there must be something about his role that is unknown. Because if he is performing that well, whatever it is, it certainly is not
the role of looking after a football team. He may be a charming individual and be great at wheeling and dealing in business and entertaning with friends. You also can judge a persons character and personality by the company he keeps.
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Post by FloridaR on Feb 25, 2010 2:08:26 GMT
One reason I like Mike’s site is it gives some space for reasoned debate from people with different opinions. And we all know football is all about, amongst other things, different opinions. If we all agreed it would be very boring. So even though I have steadfastly refused to get involved, for a couple of years now, in the pro v anti Gianni side show I hope you don’t mind if tonight I offer an alternative view of things. I had dinner with Gianni tonight enjoying Chelsea’s defeat. We discussed some of the past. It struck me that sometimes, in all the rage, we forget the bigger picture. This is now the 7th football season Gianni has been crucially involved in QPR. In the first, when he stepped in with much needed investment which potentially saved a club not long out of administration from going back into the dark hole we got promoted to the Championship. In every year since we have managed to maintain the club in this division and stave away administration. That alone is no mean feet when you go back and consider the position the club was in before. Gianni was also instrumental in bringing in a number of new investors, from Antonio Caliendo, Franco Zanotti, Carlos Dunga, Flavio Briatore to the Mittals. Things haven’t been easy, and our expectations of what might come from these investors have sometimes been cruelly smashed. But we have survived it all, and I think the current situation we are in, from the standpoint of financial stability and future potential is without doubt the best in recent history. Of course none of us know yet, but I hope the new owners, and the new Chairman of Holdings will be the best for the club we have had in recent history. There are so many criticisms of personal style, past mistakes and utterances that can be argued over until the cows come home, but that for me is the bigger picture. And at the same time, despite all of the sometimes heated allegations made, I have never been award of any serious wrongdoing by Gianni. Despite what some have alleged, he has never been bankrupt, and he has never been alleged to have been involved in any serious irregularity. In my position, I would be the first to disassociate myself from anyone involved in ‘dodgy deals’ in football. In my long association with Gianni I have never seen any evidence of that. In fact, given the militancy of some of his critics I think it would be most surprising if any wrongdoing had occurred and not been exposed. Even the most powerful cannot get away with keep such conduct, as the exposure of allegations concerning a former chairman in another sport demonstrate. So stepping back from the spats, and looking at the bigger picture, I think we find a good explanation why proven and intelligent business investors in the club continue to have confidence in the man who has guided the club through difficult times and maintained our financial position and championship status. Now I know my view will be in a minority on this particular site. That’s fine and I am happy with everyone to disagree. I have not engaged in personal attack or vilification, and I hope those who disagree can show a similar restraint. But these are my genuine reflections, not held through having any axe to grind, or for any desire for favours or freebies, and I think it is only good for reasoned debate and discussion for such views to be reasonably aired from time to time. I shan’t get involved in a running argument about Gianni, for the reasons I have avoided it before. I really don’t think it is that important for the future of the club to engage in such a debate. Whatever is said on messageboards I now think it likely Gianni will continue in his role as Chairman of the football club for years to come, and so I fear constant arguments about this will only be a waste of energy. Those who know him well, and work with him, seem to know Gianni is the best person for the role he has. More important now, in my opinion, is what plans for investment the new owners have, who manages the team and what decisions they take, and how the players perform on the pitch as a result. Just a different view of the bigger picture, and I am grateful to Mike for allowing me to give it just this once. You really should of stuck the most part of your/we (you&GP) post under one of your ' portraits' of Gianni on your photo book. So you went out for dinner with him ? SO WHAT
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Post by cpr on Feb 25, 2010 8:21:06 GMT
I must agree with Nico.
I am pretty certain Gianni does not have mean feet.
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Post by Markqpr on Feb 25, 2010 9:59:22 GMT
Those who know him well, and work with him, seem to know Gianni is the best person for the role he has. Having had dinner with the man and discussed his role at QPR would you mind clarifying that statement for me, considering it's importance? As in, what exactly is his role at QPR now? If you cannot give a full answer how about at least an explanation as to why his present role is so unclear to the supporter on the street? Do we, as loyal QPR supporters, not at least deserve clarity on this?
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Post by Lonegunmen on Feb 25, 2010 11:07:31 GMT
Nick De Marco why did Gianni end up in court with Brian Hassle ? And was he in a court case with M'boro? I'm waiting to read the straight forward answers to these two questions. We should either see two "Yes" or two "No" or one of each. No explanation required, just a yes or a No.
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Post by The Scooter on Feb 25, 2010 12:06:54 GMT
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enzian
Gerry Francis
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Post by enzian on Feb 25, 2010 13:09:02 GMT
in my experienceand i'm 63 some of the most bent people i've come accross have been solicitors and barristers.
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Post by superckat on Feb 25, 2010 13:44:01 GMT
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Post by Zamoraaaah on Feb 25, 2010 13:46:01 GMT
Definitely worth a read,. Cheers for that Nodge.
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Post by londonranger on Feb 25, 2010 13:50:43 GMT
Anyone know the present structure of the board and if Paladini is on it?
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Post by cpr on Feb 25, 2010 14:03:55 GMT
He's chairman of the dreamy board.
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Post by cpr on Feb 25, 2010 14:04:45 GMT
Still reckon he doesn't have mean feet though.
I could be wrong.
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Post by QPR Report on Feb 25, 2010 14:08:17 GMT
Still reckon he doesn't have mean feet though. I could be wrong. Surely not the feet of a former Juventus and Italian International.
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Post by oliverjames on Feb 25, 2010 14:08:57 GMT
That piece in the Guardian about Nygard.
Holloway/penrice knew Nygards Knee was a mess as well so questions again about a player passing a medical. Lining Paladinis pocket, nothing else using QPR FC to do it.
Its so transparent to see what goes on so whats going on with other so called rangers fans who profess to want whats best for QPR.
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Post by eastpaddoknutta on Feb 25, 2010 14:32:09 GMT
welcome oliverjames!
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Post by QPR Report on Feb 25, 2010 14:50:04 GMT
All this is kind of axiomatic of the lightning rod that is Paladini.
We have a seemingly-genuine takeover of the club and a seeming fresh, more sane approach.
We have a reasonably good manager coming in.
And then we have these different views of Paladini. And a fascinating set of posts and approaches as the Paladini controversy revives.
I know that Paladini has only been involved with QPR for just under six years. But to the extent that he has developed genuined feelings about QPR - and that this is not just a paid job - maybe he should reconsider his paid involvement and resign from this position. Not for his good. But for the good of QPR.
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Post by eastpaddoknutta on Feb 25, 2010 15:18:36 GMT
in my experienceand i'm 63 some of the most bent people i've come accross have been solicitors and barristers. enzian welcome to report message board not enjoying watrb atm? there dicks with regards to your posts about GP and not fair on you at all i belive your get a better response from people here as to watrb with regards to armageden thread posted to day.... who is pete calling old, he looks 65 and he aint even 50 is he!!! any way welcome pal! ;D
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Post by superckat on Feb 25, 2010 16:21:10 GMT
Welcome to enzian and oliverjames. Different breed of posters over here a lot fairer, Don't worry about Scott. We allow him to post here because his posts helps to remind us of the BS that comes from that other site.
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Post by scottjones on Feb 25, 2010 16:42:39 GMT
Welcome to enzian and oliverjames. Different breed of posters over here a lot fairer, Don't worry about Scott. We allow him to post here because his posts helps to remind us of the BS that comes from that other site. oi I like to think i'm a valued member!
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Post by klr on Feb 25, 2010 16:46:09 GMT
Welcome to enzian and oliverjames. Different breed of posters over here a lot fairer, Don't worry about Scott. We allow him to post here because his posts helps to remind us of the BS that comes from that other site. oi I like to think i'm a valued member! I think you should be out running.
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Post by toboboly on Feb 25, 2010 17:23:46 GMT
I like to think that your internet connection has expired. Don't always get what we want in life.
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